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Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

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Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#81

Post by shae »

tetrisgm wrote: post #61
shae wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're also limited and shaped by keyboards. Why only one letter per finger? The datahand does five! Why are key switches only press? What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. What about finger twist for input? I don't think anything exists? Would that be a volume knob on a key switch?

This is true. We’ve been so formatted by big keyboard that I never considered just the tip of my fingers. I hope you’ll make good use of our opposable thumbs in this new keyboard paradigm

I agree. I blew out my left arm for a year from too much typing, so I switched to kinesis style keyboards so I could put modifier keys under my thumbs. I dunno if your suggestion was meant to be serious, but it's still great.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#83

Post by wlesieutre »

samch wrote: post #82

I’ve backed this product, the Flux Keyboard, on Kickstarter - it allows for the type of dynamic changes that the author is describing in case others are interested: https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/fluxkeyboard/flux-keybo...

Similar setup to the Optimus Popularis around 2011

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/Optimus-Keyboard-LCD-Scree...

Before that they had some designs with little displays in each key, instead of a big display behind all of them

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#84

Post by Otek »

cudder wrote: post #59
shae wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're also limited and shaped by keyboards. Why only one letter per finger? The datahand does five! Why are key switches only press? What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. What about finger twist for input? I don't think anything exists? Would that be a volume knob on a key switch?

> What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. That sounds fun, now I really want to try out a keyboard where half press is lowercase and full press is UPPERCASE! No more pinky strain from shift presses.

A simple solution that would work on any keyboard (but will be much easier to do on a keyboard that supports custom layout and layers, e.g Ergodox) would be to send small letter of key is pressed under 0.5s (to be tested what value feels best) and capitalized if over this value. After a while it might feel natural to press quickly for a small letter and slightly longer for capitalized

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#85

Post by abecedarius »

WorldMaker wrote: post #80
encom wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And there's also the problem of using computers that aren't yours. I haven't tried (and I will never), but I imagine switching between layouts is at least very inconvenient.

Dvorak is supported by almost every computing device under the sun today. Old Apple models (I want to say the IIc?) even had a hardware button to switch layouts. Switching between Dvorak and Qwerty is usually an easy to find User setting. (If doing it on someone else's user account, you just have to remember to be kind and switch it back when done.) As a Colemak touch typer I envy that some days. Colemak is available…

Yeah, this is why I picked Dvorak: it seems there are better layouts but Dvorak picks up the greater part of available improvement, and it's more generally available.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#86

Post by shae »

Otek wrote: post #84
cudder wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What about analog partial key press? There are Hall effect keyboard switches that do that, I want to try some. That sounds fun, now I really want to try out a keyboard where half press is lowercase and full press is UPPERCASE! No more pinky strain from shift presses.

A simple solution that would work on any keyboard (but will be much easier to do on a keyboard that supports custom layout and layers, e.g Ergodox) would be to send small letter of key is pressed under 0.5s (to be tested what value feels best) and capitalized if over this value. After a while it might feel natural to press quickly for a small letter and slightly longer for capitalized

The ZSA firmware fork of QMK does this! I don't have it enabled on my moonlander, but many of my friends do.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#87

Post by Mithriil »

This is close to an idea I had in the past.

I bought a keyboard last year that has a small embedded CPU that I can reprogram with QMK [1]. I designed an objective/score function for key placement, based on frequency of letters (and groups of 2 and 3 letters) and finger movement (in the case of strings of letters). Each finger was weighted by how much I didn't want to move it haha. I used this function to optimize my "perfect" keyboard and reprogramed the keyboard to match it. I'm still sometimes trying to learn it to this day, I don't use it often enough. My biggest problem with it is that it is an ortholinear keyboard... Not confortable enough. Anyways.

I had plans in the future to make a small keylogger on my PC to follow my ACTUAL usage of keys, and run the optimization again automatically. Then the software could message me what would be changed and upload the layout on the keyboard every X month (not too often, y'know).

I'm waiting to get another keyboard for this, probably a split keyboard.

[1] https://docs.qmk.fm/

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#88

Post by _yb2s »

jslezak wrote: post #3

Yes! I have been wanting this forever. Keys are in too predictable a position

Exactly, a key should never be in the same place twice in a row- that's just wasted movement that could be better optimized. Letters the computer predicts you probably won't use should automatically disappear, and be replaced with numerous copies of others based on the things it thinks you will type.

We should extend this concept of constant automatic optimization to all aspects of everyday life- for example your workplace location should physically relocate each day to an optimal location based on where each person coming in that day lives. An algorithm should tell you where to put away the dishes in your kitchen based on a constantly changing optimization algorithm, so that your dinner plates are in a different cabinet each day. Language itself should be radically redesigned daily to keep it optimal, with changelogs pushed out to be learned and memorized each morning before communicating with anyone.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#89

Post by Karrot_Kream »

WorldMaker wrote: post #80
encom wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And there's also the problem of using computers that aren't yours. I haven't tried (and I will never), but I imagine switching between layouts is at least very inconvenient.

Dvorak is supported by almost every computing device under the sun today. Old Apple models (I want to say the IIc?) even had a hardware button to switch layouts. Switching between Dvorak and Qwerty is usually an easy to find User setting. (If doing it on someone else's user account, you just have to remember to be kind and switch it back when done.) As a Colemak touch typer I envy that some days. Colemak is available…

I switched when I was a teenager and have Thoughts (TM) about typing Dvorak, though I'm locked in at this point. The most painful experiences typing with it are:

1. Using a shared machine for something important. I've had to hand write and then hunt-and-peck essays on shared machines when I was still in college.

2. Typing something on a friend's computer when I'm inebriated. Not a huge problem nowadays with phones and being older, but in college trying to change the playlist when I was inebriated on a friend's QWERTY layout was... tough to put it mildly.

3. Piloting the Media PC with my partner. She types QWERTY and I don't. I keep Dvorak around as a second layout and switch if I need to do a lot of typing on the Media PC.

There's lots of both pros and cons of using Dvorak in my experience but at this point I'm so locked in that I'm not going to switch. But in my adult life, I never have to use a shared machine either so I'm always a few feet away from a Dvorak keyboard.

Re: Markov Keyboard: keyboard layout that changes by Markov frequency (2019)

#90

Post by Terr_ »

Terr_ wrote: post #49
Modified3019 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. This would also stop keypress extraction via analyzing audio.

Hmm... It may still be vulnerable if: 1. You have lots of spy-data samples that reveal which physical key is pressed (perhaps they sound different) and the precise timing of those strikes, but you don't know what scrambled numbers were actually being shown. (And it's always the same code.) 2. The trick is that users take longer to press a number when it's displayed far away from its "normal" position, because they ha…

P.S.: On reflection, I could probably have shortened all that by describing it as a "timing attack" [0] except in meat-space.

One mitigation might be to get the user to enter digits at a consistent pace, by forcing a delay between showing the random layout versus accepting a button press. There would need to be some penalty for early presses, to keep lazy users from just tapping the desired button repeatedly until it became active.

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