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Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

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Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consoles have always won on the "time investment :: game playing capability" metric. Sure, it's possible to be savvy with your time and money and build a PC that is better than a PS5 Pro for less money - but learning how to do that will take a lot of time and focus. If you already know how to do that it's a sunk cost and you probably already have a huge steam library anyway. On the flip side, if you can't build such…

I highly doubt you can build a PC that performs better in games than the PS5 Pro for $700. That is a very low price when a $300 RTX 4060 will be a slower GPU than what the PS5 Pro will have. Not to mention that consoles generally are more efficient, and have better visuals at a given compute level, than running games in a general-purpose OS.

Here's what Sony says about the PS5 Pro:

    With PS5 Pro, we are upgrading to a GPU that 
    has 67% more Compute Units than the current PS5 
    console and 28% faster memory. Overall, this 
    enables up to 45% faster rendering for gameplay, 
    making the experience much smoother.
It's not clear to me that this will outperform a 4060. Based on some quick Googling, an RTX 4060 has about 50% more teraflops than a base PS5. Seems to me that this is more likely to bring the PS5 Pro up to par with an RTX 4060.

Searching for "gaming PC" on Slickdeals and taking the first few non-laptop deals, I see:

    iBUYPOWER TraceMesh Gaming Desktop: 
    i7-13700F, RTX 4060, 32GB DDR5, 1TB SSD 
    $899

    CyberPowerPC Desktop: i5 14400F, 
    32GB RAM, 2TB SSD, RTX 4060 
    $850
Might be able to go a little lower with a DIY build, switching to AMD, etc. Anyway, the PCs are a little more pricy for sure, but they're also general purpose computers so... that's worth something...

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#82
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are you sourcing the comparison between the PS5 GPU and a 4070ti? The PS5 has 16 Gb of shared ram total and a 4070ti has 16 Gb for just the GPU. I don’t think the comparison is accurate and think that leads to an inflated value proposition in your comment. I have a PS5 and the percentage of games it can currently run at a solid 60 fps is a low percentage, but a 4070ti will consistently be at 60 fps for most cro…

> Where are you sourcing the comparison PS5 Pro has a much better GPU than the current PS5. It’s not fair to compare current HW with unreleased hardware, but at release PS5 Pro is going to be quite competitive for a little while.

Sony says "up to 45% faster rendering" in the PS5 Pro so, I certainly think we can compare.

That sets an upper bound for the performance increase we can expect, does it not? I certainly doubt they'd be underselling the perf gains.

45% faster rendering would get it up to about the performance of an RTX 4060 from what I'm seeing.

If that's true, this is certainly a solid upgrade. I don't play a lot of AAA games but my RTX 4060 can do 1080p @ 60-144fps at mostly maxed settings. Whereas stock PS5 certainly seems to struggle to hit that. (If I understand correctly, I could use the magic upscaling crap to get similar results at 4K but haven't had the inclination to mess with it)

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#83
post #21

Interesting that Sony considers a Blu-Ray drive to no longer be a key feature of the flagship console model. They’re probably not wrong, given the long slow decline in importance of optical media. Feels like the beginning of the end when even Blu-Ray’s primary creator is walking away.

Sony & MS aided in the decline of discs by making a disc drive an expensive add on and having every game need an online connection or day one update to fix bugs. I'm sure they had a marketing plan of making $90 bucks off a $10 buck disc drive and then go "oh wow, look, only 30% of people spent an extra $100 bucks!"

They were also following consumer trends, digital purchases were already getting very popular before they introduced diskless versions of the consoles.

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much the sole game worth buying a Sony console for (Bloodborne) is playable from end-to-end with PC emulation, even on Steam Deck: https://youtu.be/ItnC4GnHfa0 Especially for Sony, there simply aren't any worthwhile exclusive titles they're putting out. The good/big releases get published on PC now, and the obscure/fandom related stuff like Persona and Senran Kagura bled out of Sony platforms almost immediatel…

Lots of games still come out broken on PC to the point where it’s a worse experience, like UE4 games having shader compilation stutter.

That's true, but also fixable. On Steam Deck it doesn't even occur, because you precompile all shaders during the DXVK translation process. It's really a DirectX problem, for the most part.

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#86
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Where are you sourcing the comparison PS5 Pro has a much better GPU than the current PS5. It’s not fair to compare current HW with unreleased hardware, but at release PS5 Pro is going to be quite competitive for a little while.

Sony says "up to 45% faster rendering" in the PS5 Pro so, I certainly think we can compare. That sets an upper bound for the performance increase we can expect, does it not? I certainly doubt they'd be underselling the perf gains. 45% faster rendering would get it up to about the performance of an RTX 4060 from what I'm seeing. If that's true, this is certainly a solid upgrade. I don't play a lot of AAA games but my…

They also say with individual rays calculated at "double or even triple the speeds of PlayStation 5. “67 percent more compute units and 28 percent faster video RAM” and the images are with a PS5 @ 30FPS and a PS5 Pro at 60FPS.

So, it’s a different architecture not just a speed bump. That said, I agree in general it’s going to be worse than a 4070ti but every architecture has its quirks.

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was growing up, I never imagined the dongle future we live in.

Did you forget about the 32x and the Mega CD? We're back in the golden age of the Sega Genesis.

The Atari Jaguar also had a CD add-on.

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#89
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

PCs are a lot more hassle if you just want to chill and play games. Not such a big deal if you’re using the computer for other stuff, but a 2nd living room PC just never made sense to me.

I used to have an Xbox Series X and a gaming Pc. I completely agree with this. PC gaming usually means more freedom but also more responsibility: - Windows wants to update random stuff all the time - Other person can't hear me. 5 different software apps want to install their own audio mixer apps - Game overlay bars - Steam, Epic Games, Windows, Nvidia, all have in-game overlay bars that have to be disabled - Drivers,…

That's why I'm a big fan of a linux gaming/home theater PC for the living room. A lot less overhead and upkeep. GNOME + Steam Big picture + Plex/Jellyfin/MPV + Retroarch is a pretty nice "couch experience". The system is very clean and simple, using it is a dream compared to windows, even for normies.

Obviously it's not gonna work for everybody and everything. Depending on what you want to do it might be harder to setup. If you have games from platforms other than Steam you are gonna have a worse time. Also, if you insist on streaming you are gonna be limited to 720p on most services due to DRM (though you can delegate that to a smart TV). And if your hardware isn't quite Linux friendly it will probably end up being more trouble than windows.

Re: Sony announces PS5 Pro, a $700 graphics workhorse available Nov. 7

#90
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the general consumer, the target market of PlayStation, 90% of the way there isn't good enough. The cheaper option is 100% of the way there as far as they're concerned.

> For the general consumer, the target market of PlayStation, 90% of the way there isn't good enough. Oh come on, really? Big Picture is on par or arguably better than the PS4 interface was, and way better than previous generation consoles, and those all sold very well to the "general consumer"... I think you're just trying to argue for argument's sake here... I picked 90% as an arbitrary number, so you're literally…

I'm a hardcore PC gamer. I have a Switch, which I play Nintendo exclusives on, but other than that there's not a console in my house.

I'm telling you for a fact that almost all the people I interact with day to day RE games don't give a shit how good or accessible PC gaming is now. They're going to buy a console no matter what. That's the general consumer I'm talking about.

I'll come back to this and eat my words if this thing doesn't sell out. I think they've got more money than sense personally.

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