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EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

reuters.com

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Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#81

Post by foepys »

djbebs wrote: post #69
estaseuropano wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eu paid just a few euro per dose with other countries (and certainly individuals) paying 20x as much. Seems they are not so inefficient after all..

Pretty sure the EU paid around the same price as the US

The EU could've issued an export ban for Covid vaccines like the US and UK did but did not want to. There would have been 34 million more doses available until the end of March if they had done it.

But even in these times, the EU rather supports their allies than revert to nationalism. It could pay dividends in the future.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#82

Post by bmj »

shlant wrote: post #79
physicsguy wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On top of that, we wouldn't even yet know if there were any long term side effects from Pfizer, etc.

although we do not have data yet to show if there are any side effects 1+ years after vaccination, it would be very unlikely that there would be. Serious side effects from vaccines are almost always immediate and seen within a few weeks after administration, not months or years later. https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/concerns-history....

Except this particular vaccination mechanism (mRNA) has never been licensed for use in humans. Yes, there has been research, but never any sort of trial on the scale of what is happening right now. So, we really don't know what the long term effects of this particular type of vaccine are.

I'm not trying to cast doubt on the efficacy of the vaccines that have been approved. Rather, I'm simply pointing out we don't have much data on the long term effects on humans.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#83

Post by gnfargbl »

quantgenius wrote: post #70
jleyank wrote: post #36

Probably every drug has risks, many higher than the 1:1,000,000 reported for AZ/J&J. It's always a balance between the risk untreated vs. treated - many cancer drugs will kill you, but slower than they kill the cancer. Contraceptives have various issues, but their "social good" is deemed worthwhile. I've read that they are doing gene analysis to try and determine why these cases appear - is it gender, age, cross-reac…

[flagged]

> Population level studies on the effectiveness of the AZ vaccine everywhere but the UK would seem to show it is barely effective or ineffective.

This is blatantly untrue. Here is a US study: https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04516746 . The US NIH is reporting 78.9% efficacy against symptomatic disease and 100% efficacy in preventing severe or critical disease and hospitalization: https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-releases/investigationa...

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#84

Post by AndyMcConachie »

seriousquestion wrote: post #58
jleyank wrote: post #36

Probably every drug has risks, many higher than the 1:1,000,000 reported for AZ/J&J. It's always a balance between the risk untreated vs. treated - many cancer drugs will kill you, but slower than they kill the cancer. Contraceptives have various issues, but their "social good" is deemed worthwhile. I've read that they are doing gene analysis to try and determine why these cases appear - is it gender, age, cross-reac…

Long Covid is mostly self reported vague symptoms, namely fatigue and brain fog. It's what happens when you stay at home too much and don't get enough exercise and have a poor diet. Isolation? The Covid 15* that many of us packed on? You will feel worse and especially more fatigued, no doubt. Not to mention being constantly immersed in an environment of fear. It's a misattribution to associate side effects of weight…

One of my best friends and his wife have long covid and it has completely wrecked their lives. They had covid 6 months ago and are still incapable of going back to work. My friend was an avid cyclist and his wife was also pretty physically fit.

My friend described to me how hard it was for him to make a grilled chese sandwich and how it required him to take breaks in between taking the things out of the fridge and beginning the grilling. He also described to me how he couldn't even listen to music until recently because he couldn't focus on it.

It is only recently that he can talk to me on the phone for 30 minutes without getting completely exhausted from the mental energy of it.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#85

Post by shishy »

bmj wrote: post #82
shlant wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

although we do not have data yet to show if there are any side effects 1+ years after vaccination, it would be very unlikely that there would be. Serious side effects from vaccines are almost always immediate and seen within a few weeks after administration, not months or years later. https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/concerns-history....

Except this particular vaccination mechanism (mRNA) has never been licensed for use in humans. Yes, there has been research, but never any sort of trial on the scale of what is happening right now. So, we really don't know what the long term effects of this particular type of vaccine are. I'm not trying to cast doubt on the efficacy of the vaccines that have been approved. Rather, I'm simply pointing out we don't hav…

edited because its not worth

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#86

Post by [deleted] »

quantgenius wrote: post #70
jleyank wrote: post #36

Probably every drug has risks, many higher than the 1:1,000,000 reported for AZ/J&J. It's always a balance between the risk untreated vs. treated - many cancer drugs will kill you, but slower than they kill the cancer. Contraceptives have various issues, but their "social good" is deemed worthwhile. I've read that they are doing gene analysis to try and determine why these cases appear - is it gender, age, cross-reac…

[flagged]

[deleted]

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#87

Post by polack »

lampe3 wrote: post #3
Pick-A-Hill2019 wrote: post #2

Seems rather short sighted in my opinion given that the current scientific consensus is that Covid will become a seasonal thing as it mutates which means that booster shots will probably be needed. Given that amount of R&D funds that the two companies have put in I would imagine they would be reluctant to join in efforts to produce a vaccination for future variations.

short sighted is the mantra in a lot of EU Politics... In Germany politicians don't think longer then the next TV/Internet shit storm cycle...

The point of this decision is that they think mRNA technology is the future, so they're investing in that. While I don't dispute that lots of EU politics is short sighted, this seems to be the direct opposite.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#88

Post by tpm »

jleyank wrote: post #36

Probably every drug has risks, many higher than the 1:1,000,000 reported for AZ/J&J. It's always a balance between the risk untreated vs. treated - many cancer drugs will kill you, but slower than they kill the cancer. Contraceptives have various issues, but their "social good" is deemed worthwhile. I've read that they are doing gene analysis to try and determine why these cases appear - is it gender, age, cross-reac…

Denmark reports AZ's serious blood clotting issue as up to 1:40'000.

I will still get vaccinated with it if it's available in our country for me as I think the risk is worth it in my case. But if I was a woman under 60 and especially under 40 I would be hesitant to get vaccinated with AZ and probably wait for other vaccine.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#89

Post by shlant »

bmj wrote: post #82
shlant wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

although we do not have data yet to show if there are any side effects 1+ years after vaccination, it would be very unlikely that there would be. Serious side effects from vaccines are almost always immediate and seen within a few weeks after administration, not months or years later. https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/concerns-history....

Except this particular vaccination mechanism (mRNA) has never been licensed for use in humans. Yes, there has been research, but never any sort of trial on the scale of what is happening right now. So, we really don't know what the long term effects of this particular type of vaccine are. I'm not trying to cast doubt on the efficacy of the vaccines that have been approved. Rather, I'm simply pointing out we don't hav…

yes you are correct that we don't really know until we know, but there is good reason to believe that mRNA vaccines are actually safer than traditional methods

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/multimedia-article/were-be...

This seems to be at least partially supported by the current risks in regards to currently available non-mRNA vaccines (such as AZ).

Also I'm not really sure what saying "we don't know the long term effect are" accomplishes. It's not really adding much to the conversation.

Re: EU Commission to end AstraZeneca and J&J vaccine contracts at expiry

#90

Post by [deleted] »

shishy wrote: post #85
bmj wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except this particular vaccination mechanism (mRNA) has never been licensed for use in humans. Yes, there has been research, but never any sort of trial on the scale of what is happening right now. So, we really don't know what the long term effects of this particular type of vaccine are. I'm not trying to cast doubt on the efficacy of the vaccines that have been approved. Rather, I'm simply pointing out we don't hav…

edited because its not worth

[deleted]
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