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Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

polygon.com

81–90 of 132 posts

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#81
post #8
post #2

What is even more baffling to me is the sheer rage and lack of humanity of fans towards the developers when they delayed it several times. There was a lot of hate including death threats to the developers. I understand the internet brings out the worst in people but I can't imagine anyone desiring to be a game developer at this point.

It's not like every fan was acting like that. "We've received death threats" has become a tool to try and change the topic from whatever made people upset.

I think it's fairly pertinent that you're getting death threats to you and your family from potential psychos. 99% are probably just peeved man-boys, but it only takes that 1% to kill you or someone you care about. I would say it especially if you get a few hundred a day and you're working 16 hours a day for months on end to push out a game.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#82
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The delays were sheer incompetence and are far from normal in the gaming industry. You don't guarantee to fans personally that the game will definitely come out at a date (which is less than a month away) then delay it the next day. This indicates that nobody even knew how bad it was. There's also rumors developers found out about the delays from social media. CDPR execs are just incompetent and unable to set realist…

Who cares? It’s a game . Incompetence or not, harassing and threatening devs is not okay.

Yep, it's not like it's a covid vaccine or solution to global warming. It is guaranteed 100% survival rate for the complainers who really need to take a step back and look at what is really important in life. It's certainly not a game that you hasn't even been released.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#83
post #3

That’s dissapointing. Especially after they ‘promised’ they wouldn’t do it. I wonder what the solution is here. Boycotting the game is hardly going to help the employees there. I guess this is just one of those things that the law should mandate, but does not for some reason.

Boycotting the game won't do anything, that 0.1% drop in revenue won't be noticed when the game actually comes out

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that the promotional strategy seems to have focused on engaging the GamerGate portion of their fanbase, I’d say it’s not baffling at all. https://www.polygon.com/2020/12/4/22058784/cyberpunk-2077-ma...

I was confused by this article. I am interested in understanding better the point of view of the author and if you have insight in it I would appreciate if you can elaborate on your comment. The criticism of the character creation surprised me: sure it could be better, but is it not also the most embracing version created yet in any AAA videogame that we known of. Same with the poster: is it not cool to have a buff t…

With the caveats that I'm not trans and I haven't looked into the game much beyond reading takes like this, I'll give my interpretation. I think there are a few issues at play, some more nuanced than others.

The first (and most black-and-white) is that CDPR's social media presence has been very… trolly. For example, "did you just assume my gender" is not something I've ever heard a queer person say; it's an anti-woke joke at their expense aimed at people who disdain the notion of gender fluidity. These, I think, color the rest of CDPR's conduct; there are other things that might be considered benign if not for their consistent trolling here.

> The criticism of the character creation surprised me: sure it could be better, but is it not also the most embracing version created yet in any AAA videogame that we known of.

The cynical take is that CDPR is exploiting the issue; they know that this is a popular topic right now and they're appropriating it in order to sell a video game. But even if you assume good faith on the part of CDPR, I think this is a case of intentions not mattering. Ultimately this game is going to be played by a lot of people, and help shape how many of those people see trans issues, and trans people are unhappy with the impression the game will leave.

I also observe that people often use "at least they/we are trying" as a way to evade criticism — even constructive criticism — which makes it hard to move forward. Like, are you only supposed to engage with people that are already hostile?

> Same with the poster: is it not cool to have a buff trans protagonist - they are objectified, but that is the point of posters (see captain america or black widow posters).

Objectification isn't binary; there are plenty of ways to highlight conventionally attractive features, which is why you see films like Wonder Woman lauded for their representation while characters like Black Widow are criticized for superficially similar portrayals. And of course criticism refers only to a consensus; there will always be people who are offended at benign representation and others who are fine with flagrant stereotyping.

Ultimately, I think the author knows that AAA titles are made by teams of hundreds of people, many of whom are trying to make a progressive game. But whatever the creators' intentions, when all is said and done the game and marketing thereof will look how they look, and people will feel how they feel about it.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who cares? It’s a game . Incompetence or not, harassing and threatening devs is not okay.

Stop implying that anyone is suggesting threatening devs is ok. GP in no way implied this at all. You can point out the delays are do to incompetence without agreeing that death threats are ok.

You're misrepresenting GGP's comment. They mentioned incompetence so as to exculpate the people getting bent up about a video game coming out a few months late — behavior that, as GGGP described it, included death threats.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#86
post #17

> While long hours would be permitted for those interested in working them, crunch would not be made “mandatory.” Yeah, I'm sure that works well. How can you compete with those that do work long hours when it comes time for performance reviews? The fear of losing your job is very real and I'm sure that creates a culture where in effect everyone is working long hours, no matter what the CD Projekt co-founder says.

This is the same problem with companies that have a “no vacation tracking, just take off when you want policy”. It ends up that no one takes vacation for this same reason.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#87
post #27

And billions of profits go to owners and shareholders, while developers crunch 80 hours/week for $2000-3000/month.

Indeed, that's what companies do, earn money for their investors and owners. Sorry to be blunt, but that's how the world works and arguably talented developers can relatively easily find other jobs that are less stressful.

What an insular point of view.

While devs can, artists and game designers don't have that bargaining power.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#88
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Devs are always free to go indie and make it big for themselves. But it's a LOT harder than it sounds. So your point is?

I think the point is just that profits do not end up going to the people doing the majority of the work.

People doing the majority of the work would not be able to be paid to work for 2 - 3 years non stop on a project if nobody above them had sufficient funds in the first place. What do you expect?

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#89
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The video game industry needs to learn from the film industry and unionize for better pay and working conditions. Is Hollywood a successful business model though? Most movies don't make much in the end - we only see the most successful ones.

"Los Angeles County contributed $656 billion in gross domestic product, or 27 percent of California’s economic output, in 2015, according to a Bloomberg analysis of the most-recent data available from the Bureau of Economic Analysis. That’s the largest amount of goods and services produced among 3,000-plus counties in the U.S. and equal to the economic might of Saudi Arabia." https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/se…

I'm talking about profits, not revenues.

Re: Cyberpunk 2077 has involved months of crunch, despite past promises

#90
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not like every fan was acting like that. "We've received death threats" has become a tool to try and change the topic from whatever made people upset.

I think it's fairly pertinent that you're getting death threats to you and your family from potential psychos. 99% are probably just peeved man-boys, but it only takes that 1% to kill you or someone you care about. I would say it especially if you get a few hundred a day and you're working 16 hours a day for months on end to push out a game.

It's not 1% of them though. It's 0%. None of them are getting off the couch to kill anyone because their video game release is delayed.

It's an expression of frustration, and we all know that. Unfortunately in today's world, feeling threatened is socially valuable so they're simply playing on that. It says more to me about the disingenuity and/or weakness of the "victim" than anything else.

We need to laugh at people more.

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