Live data from Hacker News

An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

npr.org

81–90 of 111 posts

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#81
The Fed's response to the pandemic has been essentially to bail-out every financial instrument. Today we are seeing deflationary pressures. But this is only in the short term. Eventually this unprecedentedly massive printing of money will turn inflationary. We have possibly (I don't know) run the course of inventing new financial instruments to turn money into more money. Or maybe the Fed will continue to exceed its charter and and encourage moral hazard.

One thing is for sure, smart capitalists are searching for real assets to acquire. There is a tsunami of capital looking for preservation in the face of coming inflation. Look for consolidation of small residential leases, productive farmland, productive forestry and mineral land and leases in a big way.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#82
post #23

There is actually more to this than is visible on the surface. And I can’t talk about some of it. But here it is: 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged…

Thanks for the extremely insightful context. With so much first-hand knowledge of this situation, I’m having a hard time processing how you don’t have an opinion on it. It seems that this is exceedingly detrimental to the well being of literally everyone and everything involved except for those that profit from it.

> I’m having a hard time processing how you don’t have an opinion on it.

It's admirable! There's almost nothing as rare on this site as a commenter who hasn't yet leapt to a conclusion.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> diff between food farming and commodity crop farming. What is the difference between these? Aren't crops generally commodities? I’m familiar with the subsistence farmer term of the crops they eat verses the crops they sell, but the farmers sell both here.

I don't know what the original poster meant, but there are fruits and vegetables that are mostly picked by hand and usually sold fresh, which distinguishes them from things like wheat and corn that can be grown on very large farms with little labor because it's been mechanized. There are a handful of commodity crops grown at very large scale, and then there is everything else. https://modernfarmer.com/2015/03/special…

Is the concern that the growth of commodity farming will eliminate the production of fruits and vegetables? If so, I see the potential problem. But growth of commodity crops with no change in f/v seems like a non-issue.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#85
post #49
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the extremely insightful context. With so much first-hand knowledge of this situation, I’m having a hard time processing how you don’t have an opinion on it. It seems that this is exceedingly detrimental to the well being of literally everyone and everything involved except for those that profit from it.

This is somewhat for discussion purposes. Farmers make a profit, a farmer retiring can liquidate his assets by selling his land to a pension fund where in the olden days he 'needed a son', the lessee of the land usually wouldn't start farming there is there isn't a profit involved. The produce gets sold to a middle man and an end user, again for a profit. The company I work for is in finance (non-US) and has a pretty…

> Re the 'long game' discussion for finance and machinisation. The firm has literally been doing this for a few centuries so this hasn't been the original goal. I don't think it's come up yet as a current goal, although in all honesty I can see the appeal from a finance perspective. The farmer is the middleman we can cut out and replace by machines. First thought then is - what does it matter what the background of the owner doing the machinisation is?

Sounds an awful lot like deskilling, so hopefully the labour concerned has an exit strategy.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#86
post #44

There is actually more to this than is visible on the surface. And I can’t talk about some of it. But here it is: 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged…

With formatting: """ 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged farmers to collect and collate data. 4. All precision Ag, Ag robotics and farm data collectio…

For those with an interest in large markets that are not often discussed on the clearnet:

[1] https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Kochland/Christopher-...

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#87
post #23

There is actually more to this than is visible on the surface. And I can’t talk about some of it. But here it is: 1. Climate Corp was part of Monsanto before it became Bayer. It was acquired by Monsanto. 2. John Deere wanted to buy Climate as well as Monsanto but that was struck down by US courts and Bayer bought Monsanto. 3. What was Climate Corp doing before? They had something called Field View where they charged…

Thanks for the extremely insightful context. With so much first-hand knowledge of this situation, I’m having a hard time processing how you don’t have an opinion on it. It seems that this is exceedingly detrimental to the well being of literally everyone and everything involved except for those that profit from it.

It’s a very tangled web. If I were to summarize in one word, it is due to Subsidies.

Pensions and social security and international trade and Wall Street and subsidies are all tied together. It’s an infuriatingly tight ball of yarn.

If I have to be uncharitable, I would say that American macro economics is a Ponzi scheme. But..on the other hand..this is also why food is so cheap in the USA. As a country, we run on credit. This too gives an illusion of prosperity. Just think about it. How can you get 6 chicken nuggets do for $1.00 from Mickey D? Because. America. And that’s because of that ball of yarn. Try taking away the Happy Meal’esque comfort from Americans and there will be a (weak)revolution. It makes me surmise that this what America wants. Is that a good or a bad thing? Does it matter if I or anyone else have an opinion?

Here is what I am sure of and what troubles me:

1. You can’t ‘make’ land anymore. It’s a fixed asset and resource(water rights, mineral rights). 2. Land rights and resources are not renewable. 3. Land owning farmers have become poorer and poorer over the years..saddled by debt due to ..well..farming. Mostly in credit. 4. This is due to subsidies, credit to buy everything from expensive tractors, inputs, fertiiisers, seed etc. 5. Increase in population means more have to be grown in a smaller foot print of cultivable land. 6. Pressure to grow more. In farming, the more successful you are, you lose. Because of glut and law of economics(demand/supply/price). 7. Farmers are set up for failure. Value is derived from scarcity. When farmers are more productive, their margins shrink. I don’t know any other sector where this is true. 8. The credit lines and loans and debt is real tho’. 9. This will separate farmers from their land. 10. Money and financial instruments are man made constructs. Which means they are replicable. Land is fixed and can’t be created. When one is traded for another and the terms are written by one party, it’s is essentially a land grab. 11. This is why our dairy industry is almost gone. We rely on imports for food. Most mid west farming is corn and soy which is feed, fuel and fodder. Tyson exports to China. Smithfield is owned by China as are many livestock farms in az and Iowa. 12. Middle Eastwrn countries and China own acres and acres of farm land. And many more we don’t know through shell companies. This is rather common. 13. True for other places as well. Fonterra.. NZ’d dairy Co-op sold a portion to China and its milk powder division sells to China directly. China ships water from Australia and NZ. Canadian pension funds has invested in Australian dairy and cattle farms. I am not sure this is a good idea. 14. China has chronic food shortages and has to import to feed its 1.3 billion people. 15. Contrast this to India where they export excess in grains, spices, pulses etc with equivalent population and shrinking farmland. Main reason is the protection of farmland. Foreigners or foreign passport holders even if born in India can’t own farmland. (Unless they inherit farmland).

Food self sufficiency is very important. The first step to achieving it is to divorce food from speculation channels and interests. Protect farmland and water resources. This is something that has to be done globally and not just USA.

Edited to add: here is one more puzzle. American farmers growing corn and soy get subsidies to grow cheap food. But this is mostly for export. So in a way,...considering subsidies are funded by tax payer monies...aren’t we all paying taxes to subsidize exports? We are subsidizing American exports of cheap grain and not American farmers. The lion’s share of American farmers expenses(because what they make is so little compared to what they spend) goes to John Deere and Monsanto and seed companies and Syngenta et al. all publicly listed and traded companies. In a way American Ag IS Wall Street when you untangle this. But do we really want to do that? Do we really want to know where this leads?

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> diff between food farming and commodity crop farming. What is the difference between these? Aren't crops generally commodities? I’m familiar with the subsistence farmer term of the crops they eat verses the crops they sell, but the farmers sell both here.

I don't know what the original poster meant, but there are fruits and vegetables that are mostly picked by hand and usually sold fresh, which distinguishes them from things like wheat and corn that can be grown on very large farms with little labor because it's been mechanized. There are a handful of commodity crops grown at very large scale, and then there is everything else. https://modernfarmer.com/2015/03/special…

Difference between commodities and food is subsidies. Commodities are also traded on Wall Street.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But those with such decency wouldn't turn to Tillable to capture an extra buck, so it remains unclear where you think Tillable fits.

Apparently nobody turns to Tillable. It's Tillable that's turning to land owners and tries to convince them to not renew their contracts with farmers so Tillable can negotiate new contracts with higher prices, likely with the same farmers (as farming is very much a local thing, you can't farm a piece of land from a thousand miles away).

That only brings us back to the question of why landowners wouldn't go directly to the farmer and ask for the hypothetical $1,200 that Tillable would also ask of them? It is not exactly difficult to figure out who the farmers are in your local area, and it is especially not very difficult to figure out which ones are the hungry ones willing to pay top dollar, if that is your goal. Chances are they have already been hounding you for years. Exactly because people don't normally seek farmland a thousand miles away, where there could potentially be a benefit in new introductions, it remains unclear where Tillable fits.

Re: An Airbnb for farmland hits a snag, as farmers raise data privacy concerns

#90
post #40

Long term the Tillable idea won't fly. I worked with farmers as a fertilizer company agronomist for twenty years. If I understand it correctly Tillable is trying to insert themselves in the middle, acquire the right to sublease large amounts of land and mark it up. Say you own a farm and lease it out. The family you lease your land to might be a neighbor. In the winter they might plow your driveway gratis. They add f…

I hear this a lot, but all the farmers I know (UK) are wealthy, they have big houses and expensive vehicles, large families, buy up lots of local properties (buoying property prices, ie pushing them higher) ...? So, does the small margin matter if it covers high wages for the limited number of workers needed? Or am I mislead?
Post reply on HN