Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

discussions.apple.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 311 posts

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#81

Post by amrrs »

missosoup wrote: post #80
amrrs wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This cliched argument is quite ironic and insane. A leader doesn't have to be visionary all the time. Just last week there was a news about Apple selling more Watches than the entire Swiss industry and no one would talk about Cook there but when things go wrong, we forget that it's someone in QA or Product but all the blame goes to how Cook isn't a Product guy.

> A leader doesn't have to be visionary all the time Yes they do. If they're not visionary, then they're just a manager. Apple grew because of a visionary, and now it shrinks because the best a manager can do is try to maintain the status quo in the face of changing factors. It's fundamentally a losing battle.

Perhaps I wasn't specific - "Product Visionary" I meant!

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#82

Post by [deleted] »

rorykoehler wrote: post #49
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can tweak the touch bar to put e.g. volume control on the 'home screen' if you prefer; it's hard to find though, it's under Keyboard, then the Customize Control Strip button at the bottom.

I just checked. Unless I'm missing something there is no simple volume control like on the physical keyboard? I already have the volume button on my touchbar home screen however tapping it opens a slider. I don't want or need a slider and have to do a tap and then slide to get the volume down whilst before it was one press of a button. This usually requires me to look away form what I'm doing. It's definitely a step…

[deleted]

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#83

Post by missosoup »

amrrs wrote: post #81
missosoup wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A leader doesn't have to be visionary all the time Yes they do. If they're not visionary, then they're just a manager. Apple grew because of a visionary, and now it shrinks because the best a manager can do is try to maintain the status quo in the face of changing factors. It's fundamentally a losing battle.

Perhaps I wasn't specific - "Product Visionary" I meant!

In the context of what we're discussing here, everything Apple does is product (including services), and needs a product visionary.

They've degenerated to minmaxing profits and running focus groups to tell them what to do without any overarching vision or long term plan, just like GP commenter said. It's sad. Steve Jobs is spinning in his grave.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#84

Post by thijsvandien »

lqs469 wrote: post #21

Cook is a complete businessman, best at cutting costs, increasing profits and attracting customers to buy more. Don't forget that memory began to weld on the motherboard because this can only be replaced and not upgraded. He was a businessman, not an engineer or a designer, and that was the beginning of apple's decline.

Tim Cook is (to an extent?) an engineer. He has a Bachelor of Science in Industrial Engineering as well as a Master of Business Administration.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#85

Post by zymhan »

krn wrote: post #76
nujabe wrote: post #15

What's disturbing is that Apple seem to be deleting posts: After attempting to be part of the solution; spending a ton of time testing, providing information in the community, communicating with Apple Engineers and Apple Business Team, our most recent post was deleted as "Speculative". We have spent over $300,000 on Apple hardware over the years both business and consumer and now our voice has been muted. How can we…

> How can we move forward using Apple? And why should they? What's wrong with trying out something like Thinkpad X series[1] instead? Or Thinkpad P series, which can now come with Ubuntu LTS pre-installed. I wonder, if they would have invested so much time in fixing Dell's issues for Dell. Probably not. Why? Because there is no Dell's lock-in. [1] https://www.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/thinkpad/thinkpad-x/c/t...

Oh come now, you surely understand that you cannot just drop in a Windows or Linux PC as a replacement for a Mac, just like you couldn't do the opposite. Organizations have management tools, single sign on, and software that may only run on one OS.

Suggesting a ThinkPad or Dell as a replacement is naive.

If an organization wants to change the computers it gives it's employees so dramatically, it will take some transition time, and a lot of fighting. We're not just talking about your personal laptop here.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#86

Post by vxNsr »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #33
walrus01 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I had to guess they know what they're doing engineering wise, but they're taking a calculated (and poorly thought out, in my opinion) risk that a small percent of people will regularly peg the cpu at 100% usage, and they're further relying upon clock rate throttling and the cpu die thermal sensor to keep things from melting down. Or the management/product design group has overridden the input of the people who act…

That's why I buy gaming laptops for my work needs even though I don't play games. Their heatsinks are generously sized resulting in good thermals and acoustics.

but then you end up with a monster of a machine.

Why can't laptop engineers just find a way to break physics, it's not that hard, Einstein did it...

edit: /s

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#87

Post by slantyyz »

walrus01 wrote: post #25
baybal2 wrote: post #14

What can I say as a person somewhat close to electronics engineering: Look at that single skinny heat pipe, it will get saturated very fast. Second to that, look at those tiny radiators, they are clearly not capable to discharge the full heat flux. I simply don't see any signs of proper thermal engineering there. Apple says "we are listening now, and here is a new cooling design," then it comes out to be even less ad…

If I had to guess they know what they're doing engineering wise, but they're taking a calculated (and poorly thought out, in my opinion) risk that a small percent of people will regularly peg the cpu at 100% usage, and they're further relying upon clock rate throttling and the cpu die thermal sensor to keep things from melting down. Or the management/product design group has overridden the input of the people who act…

That sounds like the same calculated risk they took with the early 2011 MBPs.

I ran my 2011 MBP hot and it eventually bricked. The logic board "post-recall" also eventually bricked too.

The Apple support thread for that issue ran hundreds of pages, so the 44 page thread for the 16" MBP is just giving me bad flashbacks.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#88

Post by jrockway »

retSava wrote: post #32
walrus01 wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I had to guess they know what they're doing engineering wise, but they're taking a calculated (and poorly thought out, in my opinion) risk that a small percent of people will regularly peg the cpu at 100% usage, and they're further relying upon clock rate throttling and the cpu die thermal sensor to keep things from melting down. Or the management/product design group has overridden the input of the people who act…

> relying upon clock rate throttling and the cpu die thermal sensor to keep things from melting down Seems like that wasn't working fully, since they report having GPU issues after stress testing the computer (external GPU worked fine). And that is worrying. Is the thermal stress shutdown from OS, or onboard the GPU/CPU?

I feel like GPUs don't thermal throttle as gracefully as CPUs do. I have a desktop GPU and when it's at its max temperature for too long, eventually the graphics driver crashes. Meanwhile, CPUs are perfectly happy to run with inadequate cooling; they just thermal throttle.

I worry that it might actually be a software issue. GPU clock starts running slowly, software assumes that it will be running faster, two commands are issued but only one is processed, driver gets confused, driver crashes.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#89

Post by luxuryballs »

thijsvandien wrote: post #84
lqs469 wrote: post #21

Cook is a complete businessman, best at cutting costs, increasing profits and attracting customers to buy more. Don't forget that memory began to weld on the motherboard because this can only be replaced and not upgraded. He was a businessman, not an engineer or a designer, and that was the beginning of apple's decline.

Tim Cook is (to an extent?) an engineer. He has a Bachelor of Science in Industrial Engineering as well as a Master of Business Administration.

That doesn’t make you an engineer though that just makes you a graduate.

Re: MacBook 16-inch Fan Noise (2019)

#90

Post by 333c »

gnudad wrote: post #28

This appears to be a software bug in macOS or AMD's drivers. Plugging in an external monitor at certain resolutions (1440p@60Hz in my case) will cause the AMD GPU to draw 18-20W constantly, no matter what it's doing. This causes the total system draw to increase from ~10W to ~30W. All that heat has to go somewhere. If I change the resolution of my external monitor to 1080p the AMD GPU drops to ~4W and the fans are qu…

That's interesting. I was watching a movie on my 1440p@60hz monitor last night on my 16" MBP in clamshell mode and the fans were on the whole time. That sounds like a connection.
Post reply on HN