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Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

bbc.com

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Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#81

Post by pmoriarty »

Tepix wrote: post #67
dilippkumar wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Early humans didn't have poetry. [Citation Needed]

OK so speech has begun 100,000 years ago (perhaps earlier). My point stands: Would humans without poetry not be considered intelligent? Hardly.

My point had to do with writers of great poetry being (arguably) intelligent, not with claiming that non-poets (or non-poetry readers) are not intelligent.

In other words, writing great poetry is a sign of intelligence, but not a requirement for intelligence.

Conversely, being good at problem solving, tool use, and planning might also be signs of intelligence, but maybe not requirements for intelligence either.

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#82

Post by classified »

seszett wrote: post #77
SiVal wrote: post #20

We have crows and jackrabbits in our neighborhood. You drive down the road toward a bunch (I think they prefer the term "murder") of crows having a meeting in the middle of the road. They'll eventually start nonchalantly strolling to the side at a calm, measured pace perfectly timed to just barely get out of the way as you pass and stroll back again, no feathers ruffled. Jackrabbits will be sitting safely in the gras…

To be fair though, birds have had to adapt long ago to evaluating the movement of very fast moving objects, while rabbits and most mammals have not really had to cope with fast speeds until humans invented cars just a century ago.

Are you forgetting the birds of prey?

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#83

Post by onetimemanytime »

kingbirdy wrote: post #9
duelingjello wrote: post #4

Crows are social too, will hold a grudge... you's swear they were part Irish. A crow once sneaked quite far into my mechanic's shop without being seen, got up on a rolling toolbox and stole a bag of sunflower seeds without being noticed. I found this because I saw a crow and their other crow buddies were having a sunflower seed party in the alley, and one of the mechanics lost their snack. Also, crows will remember i…

>will hold a grudge... you's swear they were part Irish There's no need for this.

It was a passing comment, the sun will still rise tomorrow...

Meanwhile: Why Irish grudges are passed on - a long tradition of never forgetting https://www.irishcentral.com/opinion/cahirodoherty/why-irish...

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#85

Post by b0rsuk »

A bit off-topic: it's not just intelligence that's amazing about (some) birds.

I highly recommend the book "The wonder of birds" by Jim Robbins. One of the earliest insights in the book is that birds are the dinosaurs that survived. They are amazingly adapted.

The unusual thing is that each chapter is full of intriguing information and each one is a different topic.

Like, how could birds possibly evolve wings? A wing is only useful if it's a working wing, and if a bird evolved half a wing it would be pointless, right? It turns out half a wing is useful. It speeds up running birds, especially up a slope.

Feathers actually grow outside first, and the stem last.

The amazing efficiency and optimization of their hearts and respiratory systems.

Bird guano used to be so valuable that Incas punished bird killers with death. Natural fertilizers are very important if you try to make the most of poor mountainous soil.

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#86

Post by oblio »

classified wrote: post #82
seszett wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair though, birds have had to adapt long ago to evaluating the movement of very fast moving objects, while rabbits and most mammals have not really had to cope with fast speeds until humans invented cars just a century ago.

Are you forgetting the birds of prey?

Well, in his defense, so do rabbits, most of the time :-p

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#87

Post by b0rsuk »

I heard an interesting theory about intelligence while watching a documentary about jumping spiders.

Good eyesight tends to evolve first. In the case of jumping spiders, it was vital for safe landing. As a consequence, jumping spiders have the best eyesight among spiders. Anyway, initially brain gets a lot of extra information but is unable to take advantage of all of it. It's just for safe landing. Then those animals that find way to exploit the extra data become more effective.

Jumping spiders are devious, for example they can lure prey by mimicking gestures the insect uses.

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#88

Post by GarvielLoken »

tjchear wrote: post #78
seszett wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair though, birds have had to adapt long ago to evaluating the movement of very fast moving objects, while rabbits and most mammals have not really had to cope with fast speeds until humans invented cars just a century ago.

Predators like lions and cheetahs achieve top speeds comparable to a car driving on freeway tho.

For a whole like 8 seconds before it's nap time

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#89

Post by coldtea »

kingbirdy wrote: post #9
duelingjello wrote: post #4

Crows are social too, will hold a grudge... you's swear they were part Irish. A crow once sneaked quite far into my mechanic's shop without being seen, got up on a rolling toolbox and stole a bag of sunflower seeds without being noticed. I found this because I saw a crow and their other crow buddies were having a sunflower seed party in the alley, and one of the mechanics lost their snack. Also, crows will remember i…

>will hold a grudge... you's swear they were part Irish There's no need for this.

Actually there's no need for this comment, the mock-indignation on behalf of others.

A funny aside is always welcome in an otherwise substantial comment, and no, this is not considered racism or offending by 99% of Earth's population, including most Irish.

Re: Crows could be the smartest animal other than primates

#90

Post by jwilliams »

There are reports of crows in South America using traffic to crack hard nuts. They wait for cars to stop at a traffic light, leave the hard nuts out, wait for the green light — and then collect the results on the next red.

The same birds will fly up and drop nuts to crack them. What is notable is they will fly in diminishing lower arcs to drop the nuts. It’s a precise conservation of energy.

Remarkable stuff.

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