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The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

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Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#81

Post by mdpye »

_Understated_ wrote: post #42
tomxor wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They want to leave ? Good riddance. As citizens at least, it's pretty well understood that in majority we don't want to leave, one half definitely doesn't, the other half are mostly a combination of naive, manipulated and coerced based on false claims and social media, some portion are not manipulated or naive but have settled on some narrow view of a very large and complex decision... and finally the minority (the…

> it's pretty well understood that in majority we don't want to leave, the other half are mostly a combination of naive, manipulated and coerced based on false claims and social media... What? There was a vote. A vote where everyone elligible had the chance to voice their opinion and the majority (albeit slim) said "we want out". As for the slur of being naieve and manipulated that's bullshit (from my standpoint anyw…

But the vote was poorly informed and actively manipulated. Many people voted leave as a protest against the state of the country, not the EU, and have said so. And many of the most persuasive statements made by the leave campaign were shown to be deliberate falsehoods.

I respect the desires of those who genuinely wish to leave the EU, but the referendum result was not anything close to a true measurement of that, and any measure since has been grossly polluted by the ensuing acrimony.

The referendum was about many things, and most of them weren't our membership of the EU.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#82

Post by gadders »

2a0c40 wrote: post #3

Sometimes I can‘t help thinking whether the UK is just the US‘ trojan horse in the EU. Well, things might change quite a bit after October 31st, so hurry up!

You say it like it's a bad thing. The UK has a lot more in common politically and philosophically with the US than the EU.

TBH they should rename NAFTA to the North Atlantic Free Trade Area and we'd all be better off.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#83

Post by dangerface »

ptaipale wrote: post #60
pknight wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>There is no centralized database for EU citizens photos or fingerprints (not even at national level in many countries). "The database will aggregate the details of more than 350 million people, including their identifying information, such as names, passport number, dates of birth, as well as biometrics like fingerprints and facial scans." https://www.computing.co.uk/ctg/news/3074472/eu-parliament-v...

>"will aggregate" This was an announced intention in April this year. The implementation of this decision probably needs further approvals and ratifications, and even after that, it takes time. The source material does not even exist, and I expect that in some EU countries collecting this data of all citizens will not be possible due to country legislation. Thus this is certainly far from complete, if even started at…

So we should wait until every one's details are leaked before deciding this is a bad idea because it will inevitably leak?

This is like the police refusing to respond to death threats until the person is dead.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#84

Post by [deleted] »

tom_mellior wrote: post #31
karl_schlagenfu wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is ironic because some of the reasons Brits want to leave is because of the French, e.g. why does the EU parliament have to spend 100million+ EUR to have the parliament in Strasbourg for 3 days of the month?

Most of the EU agrees that the Strasbourg sessions are dumb, but I challenge you to find a single prominent Brexiteer who cited this (or anything else directly related to France) as a reason to leave.

[deleted]

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#85

Post by benj111 »

Zenst wrote: post #63
benj111 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how should the UK leave the EU? As the vote wasn't held on the basis of leaving without a deal, and you don't want a 2nd vote to ask an actionable question.

Actually no deal is what the government leaflet that they sent EVERYBODY who voted outlined. They said leaving the EU meant leaving the customs union and single market - that was pretty clear, that was what people understood from this and that is how they voted. Alas many for whom the vote did not go as intended, seem to feel that everybody else did not understand what they voted for. For me - staying in a customs un…

"They said leaving the EU meant leaving the customs union and single market"

Is this the flyer?

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...

Because it doesn't say what you said it does.

Anyway that's what Teresa May's deal was offering. The one rejected by the Brexiteers amongst others.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#86

Post by gadders »

tomxor wrote: post #29
malka wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

as a french, I cant wait for them to be out. They spent the last 50 years trying to sabotage the EU. They want to leave ? Good riddance.

> They want to leave ? Good riddance. As citizens at least, it's pretty well understood that in majority we don't want to leave, one half definitely doesn't, the other half are mostly a combination of naive, manipulated and coerced based on false claims and social media, some portion are not manipulated or naive but have settled on some narrow view of a very large and complex decision... and finally the minority (the…

I disagree. I think the majority of the people want to leave, but sadly the majority of MPs don't. What you are seeing in the UK is a clash between the People and their MPs.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#87

Post by smcl »

HenryBemis wrote: post #55
toyg wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it’s going to be Catalunya all over again. Except Scotland is not a little province, and if the SNP is forced underground, stuff will start to blow up for real.

Scotland has Oil. England has gone through so much trouble over so many centuries with murders, wars, manipulation, lies, propaganda, provocacia, and other dark methods to ensure that England will rule over the UK/GB, so Scotland and Northern Ireland (to leave UK/GB and rejoin it's natural/geographical state - Irelad) will have to try very hard for independence from England and towards EU. And it is a pity for this,…

The earnings from north sea oil would be big for Scotland alone but are pretty miniscule spread over the UK as a whole

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#88

Post by Thiez »

fmajid wrote: post #28
draugadrotten wrote: post #4

This begs the question if UK/EU got a copy of all the US citizens ' fingerprints in return. It is possible to commit treason against your own country. Can someone commit treason against the EU? Is it a criminal offense?

You can't commit treason against another country, since you never owed them allegiance in the first place.

And yet 'Assange' and 'treason' are often mentioned in the same sentence. Which is of course ridiculous for the reason you mention, but if I were in his shoes I would be very afraid they'd find a way to make those charges (or "lesser" charges that nevertheless result into you disappearing forever) stick.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#89

Post by dangerface »

gadders wrote: post #82
2a0c40 wrote: post #3

Sometimes I can‘t help thinking whether the UK is just the US‘ trojan horse in the EU. Well, things might change quite a bit after October 31st, so hurry up!

You say it like it's a bad thing. The UK has a lot more in common politically and philosophically with the US than the EU. TBH they should rename NAFTA to the North Atlantic Free Trade Area and we'd all be better off.

>The UK has a lot more in common politically and philosophically with the US than the EU.

Not even close, let's take a basic fundamental US principle like the right to free speech, it doesn't exist in the UK. The UK has had relation ships with most of the European countries for longer than the US has existed. The UK has more import and exports with the EU that the US and because of geographic constraints this will not change Brexit or not.

Re: The UK authorities made illegal copies of the Schengen Information System

#90

Post by tomxor »

_Understated_ wrote: post #42
tomxor wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They want to leave ? Good riddance. As citizens at least, it's pretty well understood that in majority we don't want to leave, one half definitely doesn't, the other half are mostly a combination of naive, manipulated and coerced based on false claims and social media, some portion are not manipulated or naive but have settled on some narrow view of a very large and complex decision... and finally the minority (the…

> it's pretty well understood that in majority we don't want to leave, the other half are mostly a combination of naive, manipulated and coerced based on false claims and social media... What? There was a vote. A vote where everyone elligible had the chance to voice their opinion and the majority (albeit slim) said "we want out". As for the slur of being naieve and manipulated that's bullshit (from my standpoint anyw…

> if that's their source then hell-mend them. Social media is an echo chamber. It's not designed for two-sided debates.

I think you are writing off a huge portion of people because their manipulation is convenient and happens to fit your opinion. The effects of manipulation through social media are a real and significant societal problem that undermine any type of democratic process. It is particularly vulnerable when the decision is poorly defined in almost every way imaginable beyond the entirely abstract concept of "not part of the EU".

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