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DeepSeek v4

api-docs.deepseek.com

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Re: DeepSeek v4

#791

Post by antirez »

putlake wrote: post #779
antirez wrote: post #448

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually the fact the inference of a SOTA model is completely Nvidia-free is the biggest attack to Nvidia every carried so far. Even American frontier AI labs may start to buy Chinese hardware if they need to continue the AI race, they can't keep paying so much money for the GPUs, especially once Huawei training versions of their GPUs will ship.

By "completely Nvidia-free" do you mean Nvidia wasn't used for training nor inference? Because if it's only inference, we know that Opus already can run on TPUs. Not to mention Gemini.

Yep but they don't run on Chinese hardware that is going to be available to everybody and will cost a lot less than NVIDIA stuff. So now you have a full non-US pipeline for AI, and soon they'll have the training GPUs as well.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#792

Post by hnsdev »

Scroll_Swe wrote: post #759
chvid wrote: post #322

The incredible arrogance and hybris of the American initiated tech war - it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. The US-China contest aside - it is in the application layer llms will show their value. There the field, with llm commoditization and no clear monopolies, is wide open. There was a point in time where it looked like llms would the domain of a single well guarded monopoly - that would have…

>- it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. I feel uneasy over China dominance as much as the US. I trust US more still as Europe has a post WW2 relationship. I notice many comments being pro China but they seem to be from the third world (one mentioned a very low salary) I feel the opening of the internet was a mistake. China is a totilitarian dictatorship. This is a fact. Look into Mistral AI too :…

I don't see any sense in trusting the US more than China. There are arguably as many arguments to say the US is horrible as the current dominant country as China would be. If anything, a multipolar world would be more positive, specially to the EU, as currently the EU is just US's bitch, and has to live by appeasing Mr. Donny, as done in the stupid trade deal signed by Von Der Leyen.

Also, feeling the opening of the internet as a mistake show the degree of your ignorance, people from third world countries also have the right to speak as much as you do, your opinion is not more valid than anyone else's.

For context, I am Italian-Brazilian, so I pretty much have been exposed to both sides (western and non-western, even though we can argue that Brazil is more west aligned).

Re: DeepSeek v4

#793

Post by jug »

shiftingleft wrote: post #704
jari_mustonen wrote: post #239

Open Source as it gets in this space, top notch developer documentation, and prices insanely low, while delivering frontier model capabilities. So basically, this is from hackers to hackers. Loving it! Also, note that there's zero CUDA dependency. It runs entirely on Huawei chips. In other words, Chinese ecosystem has delivered a complete AI stack. Like it or not, that's a big news. But what's there not to like when…

Is it really the full pipeline running on Huawei hardware? That is training and inference? The report only talks about validating the "fine-grained EP scheme" on Huawei hardware.

[dead]

Re: DeepSeek v4

#794

Post by jug »

jari_mustonen wrote: post #239

Open Source as it gets in this space, top notch developer documentation, and prices insanely low, while delivering frontier model capabilities. So basically, this is from hackers to hackers. Loving it! Also, note that there's zero CUDA dependency. It runs entirely on Huawei chips. In other words, Chinese ecosystem has delivered a complete AI stack. Like it or not, that's a big news. But what's there not to like when…

Prices are also expected to drop significantly in H2 as they move to Huawei Ascend 950 super nodes.

Yes, even compared to this low price point.

As before, the headline news with DeepSeek isn't in the benchmarks, but that they're competitive there while being gut churningly cheap for the Western AI industry.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#795

Post by tigershark »

Scroll_Swe wrote: post #759
chvid wrote: post #322

The incredible arrogance and hybris of the American initiated tech war - it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. The US-China contest aside - it is in the application layer llms will show their value. There the field, with llm commoditization and no clear monopolies, is wide open. There was a point in time where it looked like llms would the domain of a single well guarded monopoly - that would have…

>- it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. I feel uneasy over China dominance as much as the US. I trust US more still as Europe has a post WW2 relationship. I notice many comments being pro China but they seem to be from the third world (one mentioned a very low salary) I feel the opening of the internet was a mistake. China is a totilitarian dictatorship. This is a fact. Look into Mistral AI too :…

China never threatened this: "A whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again.". Also China never announced that it was going to attack Europe. I trust them much more compared to a malignant narcissist that doesn't care if the whole world burns now that he doesn't have much left to live.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#796

Post by Lord_Zero »

gertlabs wrote: post #788

Objective, detailed benchmark results at https://gertlabs.com Early takeaways: from this release, DeepSeek V4 Flash is the model to pay attention to here. It's cheap, effective, and REALLY fast. The Pro model is slow, not much better in coding reasoning so far when it works, and honestly too unreliable and rate limited to be of much use, currently. Hopefully that improves as new providers host the model. Flash is wor…

Why no mention of GPT-5.5?

Re: DeepSeek v4

#797

Post by thecus »

hnsdev wrote: post #792
Scroll_Swe wrote: post #759

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>- it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. I feel uneasy over China dominance as much as the US. I trust US more still as Europe has a post WW2 relationship. I notice many comments being pro China but they seem to be from the third world (one mentioned a very low salary) I feel the opening of the internet was a mistake. China is a totilitarian dictatorship. This is a fact. Look into Mistral AI too :…

I don't see any sense in trusting the US more than China. There are arguably as many arguments to say the US is horrible as the current dominant country as China would be. If anything, a multipolar world would be more positive, specially to the EU, as currently the EU is just US's bitch, and has to live by appeasing Mr. Donny, as done in the stupid trade deal signed by Von Der Leyen. Also, feeling the opening of the…

[dead]

Re: DeepSeek v4

#798

Post by shimman »

Scroll_Swe wrote: post #759
chvid wrote: post #322

The incredible arrogance and hybris of the American initiated tech war - it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. The US-China contest aside - it is in the application layer llms will show their value. There the field, with llm commoditization and no clear monopolies, is wide open. There was a point in time where it looked like llms would the domain of a single well guarded monopoly - that would have…

>- it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. I feel uneasy over China dominance as much as the US. I trust US more still as Europe has a post WW2 relationship. I notice many comments being pro China but they seem to be from the third world (one mentioned a very low salary) I feel the opening of the internet was a mistake. China is a totilitarian dictatorship. This is a fact. Look into Mistral AI too :…

Honestly the China scare mongering is borderline hilarious. The US has literally attacked two countries this year in the span of weeks and is blockading another causing needless deaths. Not too mention the last 50 years of US imperialism making the world a worse place for everyone, except to benefit the few (doesn't benefit Americans, only capitalists).

The idea that China is worse than America is laughable. LMK when China invades 5 countries in a span of 20 years unimpeded by anyone else in the world and maybe I'll be scared.

Until then it's quite clear how consumers benefit from actual competition and it's not because of the US.

Also you saying you trust the US when they just threatened to invade Greenland (a threat so credible that Denmark was planning a full scale resistance against US troops).

Sorry but the curtains are truly coming down and the US will become one of the most hated nations in the world while 100s of millions will needlessly starve and die because of the actions of Americans that simply don't give a fuck.

FWIW, I'm not just talking about Trump either. Democratic politicians are just as much to blame, they champion corporatism and imperialism as much as Republicans and the only issues D leadership seems to have is that the "right process" wasn't being followed.

I say this as someone who is a literal democratic operative within the party.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#799

Post by gertlabs »

Lord_Zero wrote: post #796
gertlabs wrote: post #788

Objective, detailed benchmark results at https://gertlabs.com Early takeaways: from this release, DeepSeek V4 Flash is the model to pay attention to here. It's cheap, effective, and REALLY fast. The Pro model is slow, not much better in coding reasoning so far when it works, and honestly too unreliable and rate limited to be of much use, currently. Hopefully that improves as new providers host the model. Flash is wor…

Why no mention of GPT-5.5?

Waiting on public API release. Once it drops, results will be up within 24 hours.

Re: DeepSeek v4

#800

Post by pckd »

Scroll_Swe wrote: post #759
chvid wrote: post #322

The incredible arrogance and hybris of the American initiated tech war - it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. The US-China contest aside - it is in the application layer llms will show their value. There the field, with llm commoditization and no clear monopolies, is wide open. There was a point in time where it looked like llms would the domain of a single well guarded monopoly - that would have…

>- it is just a beautiful thing to see it slowly fall apart. I feel uneasy over China dominance as much as the US. I trust US more still as Europe has a post WW2 relationship. I notice many comments being pro China but they seem to be from the third world (one mentioned a very low salary) I feel the opening of the internet was a mistake. China is a totilitarian dictatorship. This is a fact. Look into Mistral AI too :…

There is no morality at Country level. The talk about values, morality, just world is only a lip service and pretty much every smart person knows this. If you still want to hold a country for moral standards, our own dear USA's standards would be pathetically low. One example - we force and demand every other country to use USD as the reserve currency. If anyone considers the alternative, we follow the usual routines (bombing, hacking, kidnapping, Tarrifs, coercing, currency sabotage, etc). If two countries in some remote corner of world want to exchange goods and transact in their own local currency, what legal rights does the USA have to stop it and force them to use USD? and punish them if they do not listen? Just because we are aligned with Western Europe, do not assume moral high grounds.
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