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“It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

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Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#791

Post by GekkePrutser »

navanchauhan wrote: post #582
GekkePrutser wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah and there's also mautrix-imessage for those wanting to use element. I know it's rough setting up but there's a really great ansible playbook that makes it easy to maintain. I really love having all my messaging consolidated and not having all those privacy-invasive apps on my phone. Having my chats all in one big database is another boon. The playbook doesn't support mautrix-imessage but that's because that need…

mautrix-imessage is actually developed by Beeper. iirc they just send you a jailbroken iPhone if you subscribe to them (as far as I can remember)

Yes, tulir works for beeper. But I think they stopped doing that iPhone thing, and if you use iOS there are less features available: https://github.com/mautrix/imessage/blob/master/ROADMAP.md . A Mac with SIP disabled is now the recommended method (apparently this can be a VM too!)

That iPhone thing was something they did in the beginning, before they used the name Beeper, I forget the name they used.

I like the idea of Beeper but self-hosting is important to me, so I use the ansible playbook instead. For hosted services there's also Element One by the way, though that doesn't include the iMessage bridge.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#792

Post by GekkePrutser »

kelnos wrote: post #634
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #588

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> group chats don't work over SMS I have multiple group chats running with mixtures of iPhone and Android users.

You're using MMS for those group chats, not SMS.

Yes indeed, and some networks here in Europe don't support MMS anymore.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#793

Post by GekkePrutser »

CharlesW wrote: post #670
GekkePrutser wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with moving groups over to iMessage is that you'll always leave some Android users out. Here in Spain Apple has a minority marketshare so that makes iMessage a total non-starter. But even in the US not everyone has an iPhone. And really iMessage is not so much better than the cross-platform alternatives that it's worth leaving some friends out.

> The problem with moving groups over to iMessage is that you'll always leave some Android users out. I'm on several text chains with a mix of iOS and Android users. It works fine.

But that uses MMS which many networks here (Europe) don't support anymore, or they charge a hefty fee (even though big SMS bundles are still a thing here). Especially for international use.

I didn't realise it was still used in the US though.

MMS definitely doesn't work on my phone, though I'm not sure if this is a provisioning/settings thing or that the provider has abandoned it. I never really looked into it as I've never needed it. I just tested it once to see if it worked.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#794

Post by thomasahle »

ITT: Hundreds of iPhone users who'd rather have a shitty fallback to MMS than a better standard benefitting users of both platforms.

I don't see a single way using RCS as fallback over MMS would result in a worse experience for iMessage users. Apple users always like to complain about green messages in group chats. Why not do something simple that would fix it?

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#795

Post by benknight87 »

simonjgreen wrote: post #367

SMS to me is solely the channel for machines to force a bad MFA implementation on me and couriers to tell me something is on the way/nearly there/delivered. All person to person comms, without exception, iPhone or Android users, is via WhatsApp. Anecdata from UK.

If the current dumb phone comeback continues, SMS won't be going anywhere any time soon

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#796

Post by paganel »

eek2121 wrote: post #592
smoldesu wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s really oppressive that Apple doesn’t let you install WhatsApp, Secret, Telegram, FB Messenger or any other communications app beyond their own. They fully control those app's access to their store; Apple has full say over which communication apps you install on your iPhone, full-stop.

You say this like it is a bad thing. I used Signal, which is an open-source messaging app. If Apple were censoring messaging apps I would agree with your seemingly negative sentiment, however, as someone who has pushed out apps to the Apple and Mac app stores, I can say they absolutely do not do that. There are many reasons many IT folks actually prefer an iPhone over Android. The two biggest ones are privacy and sec…

> You say this like it is a bad thing.

It has been a bad thing for me because iOS decided to get me off Whtasapp and forced me using the much worse Apple message system without me having any say in it.

I have a SE and a relatively older iOS version on it, can't remember exactly which one. I don't have internet banking and don't have very much of a financial presence online, and, as such, I don't care that much about security on my phone (hence the older iOS version).

Some time ago I had checked the "offload apps"in case of full disk" option or something like that, with the implicit understanding, from my part, that I could "reload" any of those apps once I would have made enough space available (usually by deleting some older videos and photos). One of those offloaded apps was Whatsapp.

It turns out I cannot "reload" any of those offloaded apps if any one of them doesn't support my iOS version anymore. Whatsapp doesn't support my iOS version anymore, hence I cannot "reload" it, hence I cannot use it anymore. Trying to install the exact Whatsapp "version" that used to worked perfectly fine on my phone is, of course, impossible. This is very unsatisfactory for me.

And back to the subject at hand, of course that Apple can't hold a candle when it comes to more mature messaging systems like Whatsapp (I haven't used Telegram and Signal). The "upload photos" experience in iMessage is day and night worse and less intuitive compared to Whatsapp. I also don't know if iMessage has any builtin groups and, even if it were to have, it would be of no use to me because more than half of my friends and acquaintances don't own an iPhone so they can't use iMessage.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#797

Post by raxxorraxor »

altairprime wrote: post #59

Most businesses, consumers, and developers universally continue to ignore the primary reason that iMessage is a closed platform, rather than an app on every platform as iTunes is: Apple is using device serial numbers for anti-spam, supported by a fully-authenticated hardware and software stack that does not allow user modification. This permits Apple to simply “console ban” any Apple device that spams on iMessage. Th…

> and that is a key deliverable of Pluton

But there are very important key disadvantages that come with that. And I don't believe fighting spam is Microsofts MO. Just open Edge and look at the ads. This is very close to selling penis enlargement pills.

"device hackers" - seriously? You mean people that like to have control about what their devices do. Installing software you want should never be hacking.

That aside I am very skeptical of forcing Apple to open their messaging. The responsibility to choose a different medium is on the user.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#798

Post by trissylegs »

altairprime wrote: post #59

Most businesses, consumers, and developers universally continue to ignore the primary reason that iMessage is a closed platform, rather than an app on every platform as iTunes is: Apple is using device serial numbers for anti-spam, supported by a fully-authenticated hardware and software stack that does not allow user modification. This permits Apple to simply “console ban” any Apple device that spams on iMessage. Th…

You can connect to iMessage from a hackintosh though?

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#799

Post by raxxorraxor »

inkyoto wrote: post #504
kelnos wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather live in a world with spam than a world where corporations get to decide what I run on my devices, and cripple a bunch of critical applications if I decide I want to, y'know, actually do whatever I want with the hardware I own. I'm not unsympathetic to Apple's difficulties and goals here (assuming this spam problem is actually the reason, though I'm skeptical that there aren't also self-serving reasons that…

> I'd rather live in a world with spam […] That is a personal choice, and I choose to not have spam on my phone. Several months ago I was subjected to a floodgate of good ol' fashioned SMS spam that lasted several weeks. There was no way to stop the spam because the phone was receiving it through the legacy SMS channel coming specifically from Android devices infected with Flubot; the bulk of spam now comes from unpa…

I never had spam on my Android phone for that matter, but the reliance on manufacturers to supply security updates is a side effect that is primarily induced because the platforms are as locked down as they are.

Re: “It’s time for Apple to fix texting”

#800

Post by sunderw »

yalogin wrote: post #723
kelnos wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather live in a world with spam than a world where corporations get to decide what I run on my devices, and cripple a bunch of critical applications if I decide I want to, y'know, actually do whatever I want with the hardware I own. I'm not unsympathetic to Apple's difficulties and goals here (assuming this spam problem is actually the reason, though I'm skeptical that there aren't also self-serving reasons that…

You don’t need the world to change for you. Simply use android and live in that ecosystem.

And what if you care about your privacy ? Because there is ONE alternative doesn't really mean I have the freedom to choose...
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