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The Framework Laptop

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Re: The Framework Laptop

#761

Post by SilverRed »

codemac wrote: post #587
dfgdghdf wrote: post #268

Reading down the proposed spec sheet, I'm starting to see how crappy the competition is! * Apple MacBook - Nothing configurable. Expensive and not build to be repaired. * Microsoft Surface - Much the same, but with Windows * Lenovo Thinkpad - A little more configurable than a MacBook, and much better value, but still difficult to repair. Missing premium features like an Aluminium case. * Dell XPS 13 - Much like the L…

> Missing premium features like an Aluminium case. Magnesium is a different type of premium for some.

Its extremely light. I initially thought it was plastic until I tapped and scraped my fingernail along the vents.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#762

Post by ali-tny »

apricot wrote: post #756

Not a terribly important question in the grand scheme of things, but what's the rationale behind making the \ key and the Enter key touch each other? I've seen it on other keyboards as well and cannot imagine what's gained by doing it.

Perhaps it's to make things (slightly) easier for people used to ISO layout keyboards? You could set both touching keys to be enter, and not have to relearn muscle memory - kind of, because you'd still have a weirdly long lower-enter compared to what you were used to.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#763

Post by airbreather »

Waterluvian wrote: post #682
Judgmentality wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Thanks to Apple, there's probably a solid "aluminium case" manufacturing pipeline that Framework might be able to leverage. Apple literally has buildings filled with thousands of CNC machines milling aluminum laptop cases. Apple does not manufacture things the same way as the rest of the industry, as they have the money and the scale to do whatever the fuck they want. https://beneinstein.medium.com/no-you-cant-manu…

And it shows. I've never had an aluminum laptop feel like a macbook chassis. There's just something about the thickness? Rigidity?

I have Xaiomi mac like clone that was less than half the price for same specs and the body is totally ridged aluminum.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#764

Post by nfw2 »

apricot wrote: post #756

Not a terribly important question in the grand scheme of things, but what's the rationale behind making the \ key and the Enter key touch each other? I've seen it on other keyboards as well and cannot imagine what's gained by doing it.

The purpose of this feature is to ward off those of us with design OCD. We are the most annoying users to support

Re: The Framework Laptop

#765

Post by waheoo »

samizdis wrote: post #103

Ars Technica has a sceptical but optimistic/hopeful take on it: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2021/02/framework-startup-de... Edit to add quote from Ars article: Framework is promising an awful lot in its very first product—"thin as an XPS 13, repairable as a custom-built gaming PC" is a pretty tall order to live up to. We very much want to believe, but it's going to take a full Ars Technica teardown before we're c…

I'm very hopefully for this company. I just hope they drop the passive aggressive "block" remarks.

Maybe its me but I suspect they're referring to decade old ThinkPad that have since evolved a lot to thin performance beasts.

Passive aggressive remarks towards things your target market holds nostalgia for is likely not going to end well.

It's also setting themselves up for failure if their cooling solution doesn't beat a modern ThinkPads dual fan solution.

The aluminium case is also extremely questionable. Is your target demo thinkpad users or Dell users that want to take things apart. Hate to break it to you but Dell users don't give a fuck. It's why they have a Dell. Most think pad users value plastic chassis. They're lighter (13" at 1.3kg, are you nuts?) more durable, and more palatable on your lap when they warm up they're also more cost effective.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#766

Post by t0astbread »

ppezaris wrote: post #195
XorNot wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple burns almost all of their space savings on making the machine thinner, to the point of absurdity. Apple is content to push everything into dongles (which you have to carry around anyway) to get it thinner. The point at which I can't have a wired RJ45 ethernet port is already ridiculous - that is not a thick connector. Same with fullsize USB ports. Battery life there are hard limits as well: nobody is making a l…

I'm sorry who is using RJ45 ports on a laptop these days? Seems like that question was asked and answered years ago, and wifi has won.

Apart from what everyone else was already saying I have another cool use case: When transferring large files between two devices it's neat to be able to establish a point-to-point Ethernet connection between them, configure static IP addresses and netcat the files over it. It's fast, I don't need to encrypt anything and I'm not hogging anyone's bandwidth.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#767

Post by charrondev »

bscphil wrote: post #726
zimpenfish wrote: post #716

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Trying to hold down the giant button (which takes quite a bit of force) while trying to drag your finger... ugh. It's miserable. Not wishing to detract from your personal experience but "quite a bit of force" is at odds to mine - on this M1 MBP, it takes less force to activate the trackpad click than it does to activate a keypress. And once you've clicked, you can use a second figure to drag; no need to try and dra…

Yes, your point is entirely fair. I should have clarified that I was talking about an older (mid decade) MacBook Pro. It requires enough force that, with my arm just positioned normally, I can actually feel the torque applied down the whole of my forearm. My understanding is that Apple has made the clicks much lighter in their later models - along with doing the exact same thing with the keyboard keys, which for me g…

The latest iterations as I understand are like this:

- keyboards were reverted similar to how they were around 2015. - all the new trackpads are don’t require a physical actuation to activate. You can apply the same amount of minimal pressure anywhere on the trackpad and it “presses back” at you to simulate a physical click. It’s quite convincing.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#768

Post by xur17 »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #310
folkrav wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thinkpads are far from being uniformly good, some models flat out suck. Macs aren't immune to lemons either - see all the issues with their keyboards after 2016, or the failing GPUs in some MBPs. Some XPSes are good, but many models had horrible coil whine as well. The LG gram was fine, if light and portable was what you're looking for. The HP Envy line has been pretty decent recently. Back in school I've had an Asus…

I recently strongly considered a System76 Lemur but ultimately opted for a Thinkpad X1 Nano instead due to reports of QC issues with Clevo (and thus System76) laptops. It's too bad because I think they get a lot right with bringing Linux to the general consumer market, and Pop!_OS gets a few things right that plain Ubuntu gets wrong.

I have gone down a similar path twice now, and also landed on the Thinkpad X1, due to a mix of QC concerns, low screen resolution, and bulky looking laptop. My main concern about Framework is QC, and making a sleek laptop (something that I would guess would be difficult to get right directly out of the gate).

Re: The Framework Laptop

#769

Post by nrp »

lifeisstillgood wrote: post #636

This is a little off-topic, but it makes me proud that HN can have two major IPOs (one coinbase!) on the front page, but the top story is a damn-cool laptop we all want to tinker with. We have not been subsumed by The Man yet :-)

We were pleasantly surprised too! It's great to see the interest, and we can't want to get it out there.

Re: The Framework Laptop

#770

Post by philistine »

zitterbewegung wrote: post #639
nkrisc wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For whatever reason, I've never used a laptop that wasn't a MacBook that has had a trackpad anywhere as amazing as what Apple has done. I don't know if the problem is hardware, software, or both, but as a consumer I don't care. I'll never buy a non-Apple laptop until I can find one that has a trackpad as good or better. That's my personal requirement. On a personal laptop I always use the trackpad so I want it to be…

I think that since they manufacture so many other touch devices that the software, data and or expertise in designing those devices transfers over into touchpads.

Apple had the best trackpads in the industry before they made the iPhone. That company just values good laptop design; after all, they invented it.
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