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Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

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Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#711

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So I guess what's going on in Assam with NRC is just sauce for the gander to you?

What’s happening in Assam with the NRC is why I’m not surprised about what’s happening in America. People don’t like it when people who are different from them come to their country, especially illegally, and then vote in their elections, take advantage of their public services, etc. The last couple of hundred years of geopolitics has been people fighting each other until they can have a country with just the people…

Well Trump via a number of high profile anti-immigration polices has given Biden a Casus Belli to give that 11 million people citizenship.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#712
post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, lies and propaganda only have to win once.

Nope. As long as there is potential for other powers to grow or counteract it, you have a chance to course correct. Isn’t that what a vote is good for?

Sure, but being able to vote is not guaranteed, either. If the propaganda wins out, they can stop allowing votes.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#713

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> unauthorized Whitehouse tour. This is awful, and I can't imagine the thought process that leads to this kind of rationalization. MANY members of the crowd are known to have been armed. Five people are dead. Congress had to be evacuated. Had an escape route not existed (many nations don't have cold war fortifications in their legislative buildings!) we could very easily have been looking at a hostage situation. This…

We've have many instances of armed protestors / rioters over the past year. Many where figures of authority were targeted. Where the people burning thing in the hallway of the Portland Mayors house, just being nice or was their goal to burn it down? Were the individuals inciting riots with ACAB and other slogans, followed by aggressive assaults of police and small businesses just innocent aggrevators or was their int…

Just a note, some of those charged with arson/destruction of property/other violence which were originally thought to be BLM protesters have actually been far-right extremists looking to incite the race-war. This isn't just some conspiracy theory what-if, these are actual charges against real people who seem to be right-wing domestic terrorists according to the federal justice system.

https://www.justice.gov/usao-mn/pr/self-described-member-boo...

http://stmedia.startribune.com/documents/Hunter_complaint_af...

A good chunk of those "BLM" protesters actually charged usually aren't necessarily leftists, but often are just anarchists who seem to be taking advantage of the chaos. Hard to be both a radical leftist who wants to have an overbearing regulatory state trying to take away your freedoms and also be an anarchist, those are usually two entirely separate viewpoints.

https://apnews.com/article/virus-outbreak-race-and-ethnicity...

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#714

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People have to understand that this is what free speech actually looks like. Some people want to say some things, and other people don’t want to say them, so the latter choose not to help the former. In this case, the people running Amazon decided not to help the people running Parler anymore. And it is decentralized. No central authority told Amazon to drop Parler; Amazon decided on their own. I think a lot of young…

> And it is decentralized. No central authority told Amazon to drop Parler; Amazon decided on their own. Actually, Amazon didn't decide on their own—which is why none of us are surprised by their "decision". It was made for them, somewhere else. But where? By who? How? You'd think on a site supposedly interested in computer science that people would be aware that distributed consensus is a thing. You don't need a lit…

So your theory is that the U.S. is a distributed consensus system but for some reason the company of Amazon.com, Inc. does not participate as a node?

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#715

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The parts of the world you’re talking about are mostly ethnostates, tied together by deep cultural, linguistic, and historical bonds. Those things create the basic framework from which people can have rational, fact-based discussions. The US doesn’t have that. My wife says we’re a “credo country” but it’s not clear to me we share much in the way of credo anymore either. Senator Ed Markey says the constitution, the cl…

Where I live is not exactly a country tied together in that way. And yet, we have plenty of immigrants, first and second generation in politics. We also have the backlash against that, roughly equivalent to the position the Republican party in the USA takes. But that doesn't mean that the USA needs to have a fact-free Republican party, it could easily change if it really wanted to, at the expense of not being in powe…

> But that doesn't mean that the USA needs to have a fact-free Republican party, it could easily change if it really wanted to, at the expense of not being in power for a couple of decades.

If Democrats held power for a couple of decades, the country would be unrecognizable. Take, for example, the issue of religion. Americans are the most religious developed country by far—comparable to Iran. This drives Democrats crazy, and through the period during which they controlled the Supreme Court based on FDR’s appointments, they turned America into one of the most secular countries in the world in terms of the law. European countries far less religious than the US have far more public accommodation for things like religious instruction in schools. Imagine going into Poland or Hungary and declaring that Christianity has to be removed from schools, like in France. It doesn’t matter what you think of these policies. What do you think the societal reaction would be to that?

Or take abortion. Most of Europe’s abortion laws (in most countries, prohibiting abortions after 10-14 weeks absent some exigent circumstance) would be unconstitutional in the US under Roe. (Even Sweden’s 18 week limit would be unconstitutional.) Imagine, again, going into Poland and telling them that they have to have the same abortion laws as the Netherlands. (Even France is too conservative for this hypothetical.) Again, forget what you think of the policy. How would that play out as a matter of social and political dynamics?

> It's the difference between John McCain and Donald Trump, the one a principled politician who believed lots of things that I would not subscribe to but who was fundamentally a decent human being. Trump is not a decent human being, never was and never will be and his legacy has the power to utterly divide and destroy the United States.

I agree that McCain was a decent person and Trump is a very bad person. But apart from that, McCain wasn’t selling what Americans actually wanted. The Republican base is socially conservative, economically moderate, and wants the party to push back in cultural change. (Again, let’s keep in mind that America is conservative like Poland, not liberal like France.) McCain didn’t fight for any of those things. Trump, for all of his faults, was willing to do that. It’s unfortunate that he’s such a bad, undisciplined person, but there is a reason he got the second highest vote total of any President in history.

> Coalition governments are a lot safer in that that respect because they take away the insane power of the small fraction that decides who is king in the USA. There also is a real problem with the president having as much power as they do.

I agree Presidential systems are bad and encourage cults of personality.

> I see the USA - as one of the oldest democracies - as deeply flawed, with a thin critical path to fixing itself. If it doesn't then one day maybe sooner, maybe later, it will fall apart in either two or maybe even three countries (2x coastal, mid). That will cause a lot of grief so better to avoid that fate, which will require some major overhauling of the constitution and some power removed from the states. Time will tell, for all my friends alive in the USA right now I sincerely hope that this can be postponed long enough that the country can first heal from the last attempt at splitting it.

People say they don’t want the US to split, but nobody actually wants to do anything to prevent that. To circle back to my example, imagine your country is half Poland and half France and each side ends up governing about half the time. How would that turn out? Democrats don’t moderate themselves (on social and religious issues—the party self moderates on economic issues to keep its coalition together) because they’re convinced that they’re just one or two elections away from “demographic destiny.” And even if that’s true, France governing Poland by a permanent 53-47 margin isn’t going to lead to a happy unified country.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#716
post #702
post #691

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a valid reason. The government isn't a tech company or an infrastructure provider. You wouldn't ask the government to build their own roads or bridges, so like everything else software and services need to be contracted out as well. Of course that doesn't mean they should use AWS by default, but asking every single government agency to build their own data centers and CDNs is foolish.

> You wouldn't ask the government to build their own roads or bridges Bad analogy, because we're not talking about the building of bridges (software), we're talking about where they are built. In your example, the government surely wouldn't pay to have a bridge built on private property where access could be rescinded immediately if the land owner was so inclined.

Why is the assumption that three letter government agencies are signing the same contract with Amazon as a random startup? Amazon built an entire new instance of AWS just for government use. I'm pretty sure they wouldn't be able to deny access on a whim.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#717
post #257

That is the most depressing part for me - how easily American society is scared into giving up their freedom ideals. Turns out they don't have to be threatened with overwhelming force. They don't need to be threatened with death, starvation or torture. They don't need to be threatened by economic ruin or untold suffering. No, the richest and most safe civilization ever existed on the face of the planet is ready to gi…

An alternate take on current events is that Americans are correctly updating on new evidence around right to amplification, in a direction you don't personally prefer.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#718

Earlier quoted context omitted.

However, what if the election really was fraudulent? I mean the video in Georgia after the election observer were sent home, were pretty incriminating. Also seeing how BLM got backing and did way more damage, makes this all look pretty one-sided. It's only okay if they do it.

Interestingly, the democrats would have fixed the elections but only managed to win the Senate in a tight run-off? After spending $100 million, the Trump campaign's legal team found no admissible evidence of election fraud, just videos they can use for future campaigns attacking democracy.

What is happening to this site? The comment above is alleging election fraud, which has been debunked by multiple court rulings from judges across the political spectrum. It is not downvoted, flagged, nothing. The comment responding it to it gets downvoted?

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#719

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Working for a third party that provides govt infra, we/my org see it as a license to print money and an opportunity to lock govt in. Really perverse incentives.

> we/my org see it as a license to print money and an opportunity to lock govt in. Really perverse incentives. That's so fucking wrong, but I bet the government continually falls for this trap.

They pat themselves on the back for falling into it. Congratulations and drinks all round after you've signed millions over to big blue for a glorified application level firewall.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#720
post #257

That is the most depressing part for me - how easily American society is scared into giving up their freedom ideals. Turns out they don't have to be threatened with overwhelming force. They don't need to be threatened with death, starvation or torture. They don't need to be threatened by economic ruin or untold suffering. No, the richest and most safe civilization ever existed on the face of the planet is ready to gi…

> No, the richest and most safe civilization ever existed on the face of the planet is ready to give up on freedom because of TV picture and a bunch of talking heads on TV and Twitter that told them there was an "insurrection"

Is it the richest and safest? What would you call the event that happened that day?

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