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Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

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Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#661

Post by confidantlake »

sanderjd wrote: post #637
dragonwriter wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The danger is unreal not because it failed, but because it was obviously going to fail They came very close to having members in the hands of the mob; I think you very much overestimate what was required for this to succeed. Even if the mob itself was disavowed, simply getting a presiding officer more that would be more sympathetic to the President’s interests int he circumstances (which probably would have taken a…

It is making me very disappointed that all the good comments in this thread are downvoted and all the bad ones upvoted. Looking like end times for this community, to me. I don't want to participate in a community with a bunch of insurrection apologists.

Agreed, it is pretty gross. You aren't the only one who feels that way.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#662

Post by rayiner »

jacquesm wrote: post #641
rayiner wrote: post #634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the answer is, you want to win rather than heal political schisms. Which is a perfectly fine answer! But that's the approach the other side has taken also, and well here we are. Politics isn't about rationality or facts or what one side thinks is "reasonable." Nobody approaches the Israel/Palestine conflict by asking "well who has the more rational argument here?" That would be silly. Politics is about power, and…

I think you mistook my reply. Politics is all about facts and rationality, if it isn't then it will quickly cause your country of choice to slide down into the gutter of irrelevance. The essence of politics in democratic countries is people trying to self-govern with some kind of optimum outcome for the largest number of people involved. And the Israel/Palestine conflict would improve lots if people started using fac…

The parts of the world you’re talking about are mostly ethnostates, tied together by deep cultural, linguistic, and historical bonds. Those things create the basic framework from which people can have rational, fact-based discussions.

The US doesn’t have that. My wife says we’re a “credo country” but it’s not clear to me we share much in the way of credo anymore either. Senator Ed Markey says the constitution, the closest thing we have to a social contract, is “racist, sexist, and homophobic.” What does someone in Kansas have in common with Ed Markey? A superficial consumer and television culture? What binds them together when they disagree intensely on policy?

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#663

Post by flukus »

Lucasoato wrote: post #554
noncoml wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My suggestion that governments shouldn't rely on third-parties for their infra, didn't go down well with HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25639520

Your idea is honorable, but do governments have the know-how to do it? It's not only about costs and responsibility, I don't think this could be feasible in most countries, maybe only in China and US.

> Your idea is honorable, but do governments have the know-how to do it?

Yes. Governments hosting their own servers is still the norm if anything, the same is true in plenty of large companies. It's not exactly black magic, especially with modern technology. Outside the HN bubble the cloud hasn't really taken over.

> I don't think this could be feasible in most countries, maybe only in China and US.

Smaller countries are easier, there is far less scale to worry about and computers are powerful enough that most government services could just about be run on a single server (in practice you probably wouldn't).

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#664

Post by acdha »

beerandt wrote: post #659
acdha wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whoever made decision to move him into the bunker doesn’t change the fact that the protesters did not go past the gates or otherwise do anything which was unusual from decades of protests – which happen all of the time in DC. You are clearly desperate to portray a false equivalence but that simply doesn’t fit the facts.

>>>>A poor execution does not make it less seditious

Can’t have a poor execution without an attempt. There’s no credible evidence that there was any plan to do more than protest outside. Crowds can change, of course, but that never happened.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#666

Post by IfOnlyYouKnew »

gfodor wrote: post #553
owlbynight wrote: post #546

I've been on the Internet since before it had pictures. Hosts have always had this power. It's not new. It's not free speech. You pay for a service, you adhere to their rules. You break their rules, you get booted. This argument is a dog whistle defense of terrorism.

Maybe, for a moment, consider that if a lot of smart people are disagreeing with you, and you see the situation as trivially obvious and those disagreeing as having hidden, evil motives, perhaps you should reconsider your perspective.

If anything is considered obvious on HN, it’s that Parler’s AWS problem is a bigger deal than what led to it, that “cancel culture” is worse than racism, and that the “mainstream media” should be replaced with “critical thinking”.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#667

Post by tjr225 »

danielheath wrote: post #626
tjr225 wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they paid better, sure they could. That would require more taxes though.

Not especially. Government has largely predictable load, and hosting on third parties is eyewateringly expensive (only approved suppliers, who overcharge). In jurisdictions I’m familiar with it would require (nearly impossible) reform of the bureaucracy to make it possible.

I was involved with a replatforming project in a state government that failed expensively.

I lasted six months before I left. It was infuriating and depressing.

I think with enough money the nearly impossible bureaucracy reform could be possible.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#668

Post by [deleted] »

owlbynight wrote: post #546

I've been on the Internet since before it had pictures. Hosts have always had this power. It's not new. It's not free speech. You pay for a service, you adhere to their rules. You break their rules, you get booted. This argument is a dog whistle defense of terrorism.

[deleted]

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#669

Post by snowwrestler »

smsm42 wrote: post #257

That is the most depressing part for me - how easily American society is scared into giving up their freedom ideals. Turns out they don't have to be threatened with overwhelming force. They don't need to be threatened with death, starvation or torture. They don't need to be threatened by economic ruin or untold suffering. No, the richest and most safe civilization ever existed on the face of the planet is ready to gi…

I don’t feel like I’ve given up any freedom ideals. My notion of freedom extends equally to Amazon and Google and Twitter, not just their customers.

I feel the opposite from you: I’m amazed that losing one election has been enough to make so-called conservatives start talking about using the government to seize private companies and force them to provide service to everyone whether they want to or not.

Re: Parler’s de-platforming shows the exceptional power of cloud providers

#670

Post by yongjik »

sanderjd wrote: post #637
dragonwriter wrote: post #556

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The danger is unreal not because it failed, but because it was obviously going to fail They came very close to having members in the hands of the mob; I think you very much overestimate what was required for this to succeed. Even if the mob itself was disavowed, simply getting a presiding officer more that would be more sympathetic to the President’s interests int he circumstances (which probably would have taken a…

It is making me very disappointed that all the good comments in this thread are downvoted and all the bad ones upvoted. Looking like end times for this community, to me. I don't want to participate in a community with a bunch of insurrection apologists.

Eh, political comments go through upvote-downvote-upvote cycle all the time, sometimes multiple times. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
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