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Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

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Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#711

Post by dmoy »

latencyloser wrote: post #550
dmoy wrote: post #542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You cannot buy a semiautomatic rifle in 3 days in WA. There is a minimum 10 day waiting period. You could buy the pieces and build it yourself, but you'd need some tooling.

Yes, you're correct and it's a good clarification. Thanks. The rifle in this photo is definitely purchased and would've been subject to the waiting period you mention. I was being a being a bit sarcastic about his gear being brand new and forgot about the relatively new laws as part of my joke. :)

True, I'm being needlessly pedantic here :)

And who knows, they could have bought the parts and assembled it, if they can find things in stock somewhere.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#712

Post by mcv »

djsumdog wrote: post #516
mcv wrote: post #497

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They apparently also did it in Camden, NJ, and that turned out quite well. I think the real issue here is: the police want to show that without them, things turn to chaos. Instead, they show that with them, things turn to chaos. Meanwhile, the protesters want to show that without the police, things are peaceful, and they seem to be succeeding. That's not a great story for people who believe in police brutality, of co…

> Camden, NJ People keep brining up Camden, but in that instance, didn't the State Troopers still maintain control of the area during the transition? From a political perspective, "disbanding" will most likely mean just making existing cops re-apply for their current roles (like how TVA did mass layoffs and rehires in the 90s). I'm still convinced actual disbanding, without a security force in the interim, will be st…

Some other, less toxic police force during the transition seems totally fine to me. Didn't State Troopers also take over at some point in Ferguson?

I don't know what state troopers in Minnesota or Washington are like, but having them step in during the transition while those cities rebuild healthier police forces, sounds like a reasonable idea.

Though I'm not convinced it will actually be disastrous to do without police, or with dramatically reduced police, for a short period.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#713

Post by jpindar »

loeg wrote: post #644
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole 'fully automatic rifle' is such a nothing burger anyway. M4s and M16s aren't controllable on fully automatic at anything over 10m. Watch modern combat footage of any trained unit, and I guarantee you'll see them using semi auto. My point? Semi auto AR-15s are every bit as effective and deadly as their fully automatic military counterparts. Whether civilians should have such weapons is another discussion.

Yeah you say that but in a tight crowd with nowhere to go, and enough ammunition, you can do a lot of damage. E.g., the Vegas shooting at a music festival with pseudo-automatic bump stocks.

Each bullet does the same amount of damage, regardless of whether they are fired 0.1 seconds apart or 0.3 seconds apart. (Made up numbers, but a semiautomatic can be fired very quickly if you aren't taking time to aim.)

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#714

Post by twirlip »

at_a_remove wrote: post #631
plokiju21 wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the right was in power (Congress, media, and so forth), they would be left. How much power does the right need before they're considered "in power"? They controlled both branches of congress and the presidency until 2018, and have a majority on the supreme court. Fox news is the most popular media platform, and have tremendous (but not full) control over the mainstream narrative. This as "in control" as a single…

You have left out a word perhaps I should have included in all caps: MEDIA.

From https://www.foxnews.com/media/highest-viewership-network-his...

"[Fox News] has been celebrating a 44-month consecutive streak as the most-watched network on basic cable and a 218-month streak as the most-watched cable news network, averaging 3.5 million primetime viewers and 2 million total-day viewers, according to Nielsen Media Research."

For terrestrial broadcast television in the US, the pro-Trump Sinclair-owned stations possesses 294 stations for around 75% penetration of total US households.

Also, news-talk stations are right-wing with the exception of NPR and sports.

Therefore, one can conclude the right-controlled media is mainstream media.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#715

Post by [deleted] »

undersuit wrote: post #466
11thEarlOfMar wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the right, I am seeing: - It's called Antifastan - Warlord Raz is prone to violent outbursts, and is an AirBnb Superhost. - There are open carries with automatic rifles. They get the most respect. - Laughing out loud at an attempt to create a vegetable garden. Didn't appear promising. - Laughing harder at a cry for 'please send vegan meats and soy products, the homeless took all the food!' My thinking is, the trut…

I hate the laughter at the vegetable garden. Oh lets mock people for planting what could be food where it used to a a useless piece of turf. We shouldn't be mocking them we should be following their example across the country.

[deleted]

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#716

Post by seanmcdirmid »

jiscariot wrote: post #651
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #473

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we are talking cable, I believe it. I haven’t had cable for the last couple of decades, I would venture that not many liberals, who tend to be younger, have cable. If you were going to start a cable channel now, who would you pander to: the audience that doesn’t have that much cable (liberals) or the audience that does (conservatives).

Median age (2017)[1]: CNN 60 Fox News 65 MSNBC 65 From my peer group (around forty), rather than liberal vs. conservative breakdown, I'd say those who reluctantly subscribe to cable are sports fans. [1] https://www.adweek.com/tvnewser/heres-the-median-age-of-the-...

That is only measuring people who still have cable. It doesn’t tell you anything about those that don’t watch cable news at all. All we can tell is that the 60+ group prefers Fox.

I did say liberals tend to watch less cable because they tend to be younger, it doesn’t mean that liberals in general have a propensity for cutting the cord.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#717

Post by pacala »

cma wrote: post #284
colllectorof wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The media coverage of it is WILD > People on the internet are convinced it's protected by armed guards and people are dying of hunger and instead its...like a music festival campground This seems like propaganda in its own right. With the exception of Fox and Sky, most news coverage I see on YouTube is neutral or positive: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=capitol+hill+au... Most mainstream coverage of p…

Fox is by far the most popular news channel in the US and pretty close to bigger than the rest combined.

I'm somewhat confused about the TV media landscape, as there are cable news channels, Fox / CNN / MSNBC, but there are also the big 3 networks, ABC / CBS / NBC, which also air news and are also available on cable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cable_news

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Three_television_networks

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#718

Post by mcv »

krzyk wrote: post #652
darkerside wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they are protests against the police, and the police don't like that? Simplest answer I can see

Use of force by police in those protests results in more protests. So the simplest answer is actually: protesters benefit from police using force. (because they'll get more protesters, more media coverage etc.)

The goal of the protesters is not to have more protests. I'm pretty sure they'd rather stay at home and do something fun. The goal of the protesters is to stop police violence. So the police using force is the exact opposite of what the protesters want.

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#719

Post by Apocryphon »

AnHonestComment wrote: post #686
dragonwriter wrote: post #663

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Police are safer than cars, For whom and per...what? Encounter? Mile traveled with them? > The only violence I’ve seen from police that doesn’t seem like an anomaly is violence that protestors incited by starting a conflict with the police. That suggests to me that either your perception of provocation or of anomaly is skewed (or that “anomaly” is used in the software sense of “behavior out of line with spec” rathe…

Per arrest to one year of driving: you would have to be arrested ten times in a year for your risk from the police to match your risk driving a car that year. Per arrest for violent crime (where most of the deaths occur), blacks are safer than whites. I’ve been reviewing the footage from Seattle — and protestors started every instance of violence by first getting forceful with the cops. Show me any evidence that ther…

The tech industry is trying to get rid of cars as we know it by inventing self-driving technology, so I'm not sure how germane they are to this conversation. Can we not work towards addressing multiple causes of death in society?

Re: Capitol Hill Autonomous Zone

#720

Post by mcv »

zozbot234 wrote: post #524
mcv wrote: post #508

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe there's a valuable lesson in that too: foster a sense of community, instead of trying to control people by force. My impression is also that many cases of police abuse in the US happen in situations where most of the police officers policing a community are not themselves members of that community, but outsiders looking down on that community.

> foster a sense of community, instead of trying to control people by force. The institutions that are most effective at "fostering a sense of community" are voluntary ones like churches and cultural centres, not coercive ones like police. Social scientists have known for a long time about the critical importance of this sort of civic and community engagement, but it is often misunderstood and considered irrelevant a…

Partly true. Yes, more emphasis in those cultural centres, churches, and other sources of community participation is absolutely necessary. But the police can contribute too. Netherland has neighbourhood cops that try to make sure they're known in the neighbourhood. They try to stay in touch with youths who hang out on the street. They try to make sure they know potential troublemakers and vice versa. They build relationships, which means they can talk, instead of just using force to solve every problem.
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