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GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

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Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#701

Post by sytse »

clinta wrote: post #636
obelisk_ wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, what are the alternatives? Hosted: Bitbucket, GitLab Self-hosted: GitLab, Gogs None of these come close to GitHub in my experience.

I use GitLab at work and I think the only thing GitLab is lacking is the community. What do you find lacking in GitLab?

GitLab.com certainly is much smaller. But it is growing fast and projects like mailman and fdroid are already using it. If you think of a community as the people that make the platform itself better, more than 1000 people have contributed to Gitlab.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#702

Post by mikeash »

leohutson wrote: post #654
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #629

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who cares what coworkers claim? If job performance is used for evaluations and promotions, then fairness is preserved. And the assumption that minorities can only be hired by insufficient scrutiny is not a very enlightened attitude. Perhaps the company can look really hard for qualified candidates that help balance the workforce. How about that? I agree that real progress is the right way to evaluate hiring/ admissio…

I would care if my coworkers were bigots, and I would especially care if they were prejudiced against me, how can you effectively work with someone who doesn't respect you? Pretending bigotry doesn't exist is the same thing as pretending that race/sex aren't visible. You will also have to apply the same affirmative action when promoting people, as a couple of years work experience doesn't erase the generations of pri…

If you merely know about the race/sex/whatever of your candidates then you're already giving some weight to those attributes whether you want to or not.

If we had some way of scoring candidates numerically, then yes, you'd just pick the biggest number. But I've never heard of a hiring system that worked like that. There's always some subjectivity. You can look at a bunch of resumes and rank them, but a good chunk of that ranking is guesswork and opinion. That gives room for your biases to play, and you'll end up with the "best" candidates tending to match those biases. And don't tell me you don't have any racial or gender biases; you do, everybody does.

You shouldn't give up a 9.9/10 because he's white, and hire a 2.4/10 because she's black. But if you have a bunch of candidates around 8/10, consider hiring the minority candidate who's a 7.9 rather than the candidate who matches the existing demographics of your team and is an 8.1. Your numbers are probably ±3 anyway, so it's not the irrational decision it sounds like it would be in a universe of pure numbers.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#703

Post by sytse »

pwelch wrote: post #286
the_ancient wrote: post #6

I Hope to see GitLab, and other Truly Open Systems, replace GitHub as the go to place for source control

Same here. I like that Gitlab is so open. I hope they continue to grow and more people trust them to host both private and public code.

We're certainly growing, and I'll do everything I can to keep and increase the openness. We just made our strategy public https://about.gitlab.com/strategy/

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#704

Post by sytse »

pwelch wrote: post #286
the_ancient wrote: post #6

I Hope to see GitLab, and other Truly Open Systems, replace GitHub as the go to place for source control

Same here. I like that Gitlab is so open. I hope they continue to grow and more people trust them to host both private and public code.

We're certainly growing, and I'll do everything I can to keep and increase the openness. We just made our strategy public https://about.gitlab.com/strategy/

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#705

Post by rednerrus »

argonaut wrote: post #635
EvanPlaice wrote: post #619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if somebody self identifies as trans-racial. All jokes aside, some white people grow up dirt poor in predominantly black neighborhoods and identify more with black Anerican culture then their own skin color. Do they get better access to schools, scholarships, government jobs, funding for small businesses? Etc... What about the black kid who grew up in the suburbs with a stable family and all whote friends. Should…

The problem is that white kid could dress up in a suit and tie, go into an interview, and be totally free of racial judgment (also dropping any obvious mannerisms). A black man can do that, including dropping any mannerisms, but they will still be black.

I don't know how many poor white people you know, but this isn't true. You can't undue the effects of poverty by putting on a suit and tie.

I grew up as a poor white kid in a multicultural neighborhood and I've spent the last 20 years trying to fit into middle class white society. It is a constant struggle. I've had to work harder than every one of my peers to get to where I'm at. When I hear upper middle class white women and minorities whining about how hard it is for them my blood boils.

Your parents read to you, paid for you to go to college, talked like middle class people do about middle class things, taught you how to manage money, a growth mindset, encouraged you, teachers expected you to be something when you grew up and treated you appropriately. Poor white kids, like poor black kids don't get any of this. Putting on a suit and tie doesn't improve your vocabulary or make you think about yourself like an equal. It doesn't teach you how to write a good resume or cover letter. It doesn't put internships or solid educational credentials on that resume.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#706

Post by sytse »

newjersey wrote: post #25
andyfleming wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I mean, I'm always happy to see competition keeping companies on their toes, but why do you actively want people to leave GitHub?

I am not the GP. To me, supporting GitHub is like supporting Jetbrains. I know they're good people. I know they're trying to do good things. However, I will always have a nagging feeling that wishes that the universe was somehow different and that their business model made it possible for them to freely and openly offer all their software. I guess I can include things like Aerospike and even Gitlab in that group. I d…

Why do you put GitLab in that category? We're trying hard to freely and openly offer as much as we can. We do have an open core business model with a proprietary GitLab EE. But I wonder what you think we have to change.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#707

Post by cgriswald »

dasil003 wrote: post #532
alphapapa wrote: post #463

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Let me apply the principle you claim to be the case in a different, ahistorical way: "'We need to start learning how to simply NOT THINK about denigrating and enslaving blacks, and NOT MENTION IT.' We live in a world where this is not remotely possible. Suggesting it is the worst sort of idealism." --some Southern slave owner, 1859 The same could be applied to historical anti-semitic movements, anti-suffrage gro…

You are setting up an enormous straw man. When you say people like the GP say: > We will always be just as hateful and prejudiced as the worst of us are now. That is emphatically not what the GP is saying. The problem is not the ideal that race should not matter, it's that history does not go away , or more generally we can not build the ideal world from first principles. Those with privilege often wish it was as sim…

No. As a white male, as any other type of male, you should be seeking to be educated about the subject on which you wish to voice your opinion. Having privilege does not render privilege invisible.

You saying "If you are a white male, you should hold your tongue" is hugely problematic, because it means white males should not be part of the solution to racism and should have no voice in any changes.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#708

Post by sytse »

SOLAR_FIELDS wrote: post #57
krisdol wrote: post #46

I wonder which startup will chomp off this new sourcefor-- I mean, Github. I know, totally different companies at this point, but this shift marks me seeing GH as a completely different entity from what it used to be, and I don't look forward to what kind of company they'll become in the future. Kind of disappointing to read about the changes. None of them sound good.

Gitlab has already surpassed Github in terms of functionality. I've been hard selling it at my place of employ but I work at a large company so Github is already solidly entrenched and will be so for at least awhile.

Please let us know if we can help convince your company. Email sales@gitlab.com if you need help convincing the higher ups.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#709

Post by jasonlotito »

djKianoosh wrote: post #290
coderjames wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Now you can self-host BitBucket also with BitBucket Server[1]. We're starting a migration to it at my work right now. [1] https://www.atlassian.com/software/bitbucket/download

bitbucket server (used to be called stash) has practically no search capability. it's the underappreciated killer feature of github IMO

> has practically no search capability. it's the underappreciated killer feature of github IMO

I honestly have to ask: have you used GitHub Enterprise? It's search functionality is horrible. Oh, it searches for things, but it won't find things. And this isn't a rare issue. And I'm not talking about anything other than searching through master branches.

It's a tool that I cannot trust.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#710

Post by dang »

masterleep wrote: post #511

Discrimination is fairness. War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.

Please don't post unsubstantive comments to HN, especially on inflammatory topics.

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11050454 and marked it off-topic.

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