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Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

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Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#71

Post by wmf »

ams6110 wrote: post #66

Thoughts that occurred to me as I read this: 1. Why were privately owned mass transit systems the norm in the first half of the 20th century, and why is that now considered "impossible" today? 2. Why is it OK for government to "monopolize mass transit", which they have done almost everywhere, but a criminal "conspiracy" when four private entities try to do it?

On point 2, presumably the government has no vested interest in any particular form of mass transit and thus would choose the most efficient one, while the private companies (in this case) are accused of using buses to prop up other businesses (cars, tires, and oil).

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#72

Post by nine_k »

wmf wrote: post #71
ams6110 wrote: post #66

Thoughts that occurred to me as I read this: 1. Why were privately owned mass transit systems the norm in the first half of the 20th century, and why is that now considered "impossible" today? 2. Why is it OK for government to "monopolize mass transit", which they have done almost everywhere, but a criminal "conspiracy" when four private entities try to do it?

On point 2, presumably the government has no vested interest in any particular form of mass transit and thus would choose the most efficient one, while the private companies (in this case) are accused of using buses to prop up other businesses (cars, tires, and oil).

I wish I lived in the idyllic world which your sentence describes.

It always puzzles me when people presume that governments or public offices act more virtuously, free from vested interests, agendas, prejudices, etc. I would understand it if governments imported their staff from angels. In reality, they have to hire the same human beings that private corporations hire.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#73

Post by nine_k »

bradleyjg wrote: post #26
betterunix wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was a kid, that might have worked -- the G stopped at Queens Plaza (with local service all the way to Continental Ave.), so you could take an E or F down Queens Boulevard, make a quick transfer, and be on your way. Sadly, the MTA seems to have it in for the G; the line now terminates at Court Sq., the trains are shorter than before (which was already shorter than other lines), and some of the stations are in v…

The J barely goes into Queens, only at the very end does it have half a dozen stops in Woodhaven and Jamaica. Someone below mentions the L which as far as I know has no Queens stops, and the the M which does actually serve Middle village directly from Brooklyn but otherwise requires a giant loop through Manhattan. This issue is near and dear to my heart, I live in Woodside but I have close friends in Park Slope. By c…

BTW last time I took the rail from Jamaica to Atlantic terminal (this summer) I bought a ticket from one of the machines without much complication. Did they somehow break it?

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#74

Post by ams6110 »

wmf wrote: post #71
ams6110 wrote: post #66

Thoughts that occurred to me as I read this: 1. Why were privately owned mass transit systems the norm in the first half of the 20th century, and why is that now considered "impossible" today? 2. Why is it OK for government to "monopolize mass transit", which they have done almost everywhere, but a criminal "conspiracy" when four private entities try to do it?

On point 2, presumably the government has no vested interest in any particular form of mass transit and thus would choose the most efficient one, while the private companies (in this case) are accused of using buses to prop up other businesses (cars, tires, and oil).

They may or may not have a vested interest in buses vs. trolleys. But I think that they most definitely have an interest in monopolizing something like mass transit because it provides a huge opportunity for patronage jobs, ghost employment, union/pension shenanigans, contracting kickbacks, and vote-buying. Just off the top of my head.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#75

Post by monkeyspaw »

sethbannon wrote: post #52

There is a delightful movie called Who Framed Roger Rabbit in which the villain is attempting just this: buying trolley lines to build "highways, as far as the eye can see". http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0096438/

I second the recommendation for anyone who hasn't seen this movie. It was marketed as a kids movie, but has a lot of stuff in it that adults can appreciate.

It was also one of the first movies to combine significant CGI with real-world interaction.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#76

Post by bradleyjg »

nine_k wrote: post #73
bradleyjg wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The J barely goes into Queens, only at the very end does it have half a dozen stops in Woodhaven and Jamaica. Someone below mentions the L which as far as I know has no Queens stops, and the the M which does actually serve Middle village directly from Brooklyn but otherwise requires a giant loop through Manhattan. This issue is near and dear to my heart, I live in Woodside but I have close friends in Park Slope. By c…

BTW last time I took the rail from Jamaica to Atlantic terminal (this summer) I bought a ticket from one of the machines without much complication. Did they somehow break it?

Jamaica to Atlantic is fine it's when you want to go from Woodside to Atlantic via Jamaica (i.e. east to go west) that the ticket machines have a problem.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#77

Post by krakensden »

ams6110 wrote: post #66

Thoughts that occurred to me as I read this: 1. Why were privately owned mass transit systems the norm in the first half of the 20th century, and why is that now considered "impossible" today? 2. Why is it OK for government to "monopolize mass transit", which they have done almost everywhere, but a criminal "conspiracy" when four private entities try to do it?

Significantly more regulation?

I've heard that NY has enough private buses that some areas effectively do have a private mass transit system, but I've no firsthand knowledge.

They're also slightly or definitely illegal.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#78

Post by Crake »

algebr wrote: post #36
T-hawk wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here, I live on the Jersey City waterfront and love the ferry commute. Hoboken and Jersey City are excellent places to live for a Manhattan job. We get to take advantage of the market inefficiency created by the "eww Jersey" popular image. Bonus, we dodge the NYC income tax which runs over 3% of income.

When are we having a hacker news JC readers meet up?

I wouldn't mind a general NYC one.

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#79

Post by tzs »

> Ever try to get from Brooklyn to Queens, two of the most populated boroughs of New York City? Without a car, it's nearly impossible, as most subway lines require one to go through Manhattan first.

Could someone explain this to those of us who have never been to New York and whose only knowledge of its subways comes from TV and movies?

The impression I get from subway travel as depicted on TV and in movies is that trains run frequently enough that trips requiring changing trains aren't a big deal. So what's the problem is you have to go to Manhattan then change trains to go to Queens?

Re: Why It's So Hard to Get From Brooklyn to Queens

#80

Post by Crake »

seiji wrote: post #45
skorgu wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I took the G 4 miles. It took 47 minutes. I am not exaggerating those numbers for comedic effect.

I've had relationships fall apart because of the four mile G problem. To round it up, Court Square to the Park Slope areas is easily an hour when waiting for trains to arrive. Two hours round trip is why I left the Bay Area transit wasteland for cripessake.

Have you considered switching boroughs?
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