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Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

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Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#71
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also said that the spike proteins produced by the vaccine would be gone within a few days or weeks, and new studies show that they were detected multiple years afterwards. This was "guaranteed" to not happen. The trials were too short to pick this up and what does that actually mean for the health of people afterwards.

I don't believe this, do you have a source?

Claude only found one un-reviewed paper that couldnt link the symptoms to spike proteins but a small sample detected spike proteins.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it was detected, would it or should it have changed anything? On the one hand we have a disease causing millions of deaths, on the other hand we have this rare risk. No trial can detect rare long term risk. It can only bound that risk. And we shouldn't ask for anything more. Everything is risky, but the risk bounds are acceptable.

What are you talking about? This isn't talking about long term risk at all. This is within 28 days of the 2nd dose. That is well within the reach of a clinical trial. The clinical trial should have detected this, but it was rushed. Plain and simple. The narrative was that everyone should be vaccinated. The data and science showed that not only did young people have an incredibly low, almost non-existent risk from COV…

> The clinical trial should have detected this, but it was rushed. Plain and simple.

No, that is wrong. Trials generally don't detect very rare side effect that only occur for some special subgroups. They would have to have tested 100.000 males That's also only talking about one particular side effect, more interesting would be a comparison of all-cause mortality, because that's more likely what you are interested in: Does the vaccine increase or decrease my chance of dying soon?

For example I calculated back then that getting unvaccinated Covid-19 would increase my (very low, male of age There's also a problem with the study - there's always a problem, that's why a singular study is never sufficient. Within a big data set - and tens of millions is huge in this context, you can always find significant results if you just test enough subgroups. That's called alpha error accumulation, because the more hypothesis you test, the more likely you will have 'significant' results by pure coincidence. That's why reporting significant results on (hypothetical example) "elderly people between 60 and 70 that don't own a TV" are always met with caution. It seems to me they tested at least around 50 hypothesis from what data they gathered (sex, age in 10 years bins, ethnicity etc), but they might effectively have tested more and from a first look it seems they didn't account for that.

PS:

> Why were they so desperate for us all to get the vaccine when science proved that it didn't work by end of 2021?

You talking about one vaccine in particular? Or some combination in particular? But only covid vaccines, I guess? Anyway, what you wrote is wrong. Every single one of them helped in the sense that people would be less contagious and would have less severe symptoms.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#75

One wonders why this was flagged. It appears to be a high quality and non-combative analysis of how we were able to advance vaccine development so quickly without losing safety or efficacy?

Because there a bunch of social media deluded asshats that want to argue about it in bad faith. See also: "Fauci caused COVID"

Unfortunately social media deluded asshats is the prevailing theme of the United States on this 250 year anniversary. See also: "Trumpty Dumpty somehow isn't a corrupt incompetent fraud."

The nice way to put it: this has, unfortunately, become a political lightning rod.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And they were rushed out This implies that corners were cut. They were not. They went through the full regulatory procedures. > many people still sit with the issues they caused Few medicines are entirely without side effects. The effects of the virus were in general far worse. Millions of lives were saved from the vaccines. > Not a win Apart from the millions of lives that were saved. > at the very least, they red…

The trials missed the fact that younger males under 40 have a material increased risk myocarditis from the vaccine. And when reports of that started coming out, the media and "medical establishment" fought against those reports and said the people who were saying this were "anti-vaxxers". But finally the CDC acknowledged this and added it to their communication without accountability or apologies. Their reaction was…

And males under 40 have a material increased risk of myocarditis from the virus itself. More-so than the vaccine. A friend under 40 is on beta blockers thanks to Covid.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#77

Shouldn't we expect that in an emergency we cut through red tape, reprioritize, etc? Isn't government inefficiency one of the major complaints of the types who call the vaccine "rushed"? If that was ever a good faith argument they should have seen this as a win!

Just because something happened fast(new forms of vaccine approval), doesn’t make it efficient.

I believe “the types” are generally opposed to government overreach.

The government forcing people to adhere to medical regiments against their will is valid to be concerned about.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's incorrect though. It's not a matter of opinion that populations with higher vaccination rates saw fewer deaths and lower rates of hospitalization.

[flagged]

India had the second highest number of cases and the third highest number of deaths.

And that's before you start taking into account the terrible record tracking and lack of testing.

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His claims are that because of this sequence of events “Fauci caused Covid” - Fauci led NIAID - NIAID funded EcoHealth (an external non profit) - EcoHealth sent some money to Wuhan labs - Maybe Covid comes from a leak of Wuhan labs You can decide for yourself if Fauci is just a boogeyman or has personal responsibility in this chain of “maybes” By this logic Trump cause Covid because he was President at the time.

In a way, it's a shame that the gp comment is flagged. It is batshit crazy from my pov, but this is a very commonly held opinion by the people now setting health policy for the USA. I kind of wish there was a different flag-like option for cases like this. That would mean that it was more than down-voted, but not hidden. I feel like it is very important that the disclosure of "bad" opinions should be allowed to be ve…

[CRACKPOT] flag or something

Re: Why were Covid vaccine trials so fast?

#80
post #67
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This implies that corners were cut. They were not. They went through the full regulatory procedures. That's absolutely not true. The standard for new vaccines, iirc, required a period of something on the order of 7 years. Time, in this case, is not a function of procedure that can be expedited in an emergency, but is actually an important element in and of itself. Many issues do not manifest immediately and actuall…

> That's absolutely not true. The standard for new vaccines, iirc, required a period of something on the order of 7 years. In Europe, it can take years, but because of organizational reasons and economic incentives. The whole process was completed as far as possible, but companies when through the same steps as always.

In the US, the long-term safety testing is 3-5 years, excluding any beaurocracy.

Pfizer's short-term safety testing was also cut from 6 months to 3 months IIRC.

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