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I ditched Docker for Podman

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Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#71

Post by akerl_ »

nickjj wrote: post #67
akerl_ wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem isn’t generally the cost, it’s the complexity. You end up having to track who has it installed. Hired 5 more people this week? How many of them will want docker desktop? Oh, we’ve maxed the licenses we bought? Time to re-open the procurement process and amend the purchase order.

A large company who is buying licenses for tools has to deal with this for many different things. Docker is not unique here. An IT department for a company of that size should have ironed out workflows and automated ways to keep tabs on who has what and who needs what. They may also be under various compliance requirements that expect due diligence to happen every quarter to make sure everything is legit from a licen…

Idk what to tell you other than that it is.

Large companies do have ways to deal with this: they negotiate flat rates or true-up cadences with vendors. But now you’ve raised the bar way higher than “just use podman”.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#73

Post by politelemon »

esseph wrote: post #63
mrighele wrote: post #42

> If your Docker Compose workflow is overly complex, just convert it to Kubernetes YAML. We all use Kubernetes these days, so why even bother about this? I find that kubernetes yaml are a lot more complex than docker compose. And while I do, no, not everybody uses kubernetes.

Having an LLM function as a translation layer from docker compose to k8s yaml works really well. On another note, podman can generate k8s yaml for you, which is a nice touch and easy way to transition.

Use an LLM is not a solution. It's effectively telling you to switch your brain off and hope nothing goes wrong in the future. In reality things do go wrong and any conversation should be done with a good understanding of the system involved.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#74

Post by solarkraft »

stingraycharles wrote: post #19
raquuk wrote: post #5

The "podman generate systemd" command from the article is deprecated. The alternative are Podman Quadlets, which are similar to (docker-)compose.yaml, but defined in systemd unit files.

Which actually makes a lot of sense, to hand over the orchestration / composing to systemd, since it’s not client server API calls (like with docker) anymore but actual userland processes.

It totally does! On the con side, I find systemd unit files a lot less ergonomic to work with than compose files that can easily be git-tracked and colocated.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#75

Post by linuxftw »

LelouBil wrote: post #61
xhrpost wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the official docs: >This section describes how to install Docker Engine on Linux, also known as Docker CE. Docker Engine is also available for Windows, macOS, and Linux, through Docker Desktop. https://docs.docker.com/engine/install/ I'm not an expert but everything I read online says that Docker runs on Linux so with Mac you need a virtual environment like Docker Desktop, Colima, or Podman to run it.

Docker desktop will run a virtual machine for you. But you can simply install docker engine in wsl or in a VM on mac exactly like you would on linux (you give up maybe automatic port forwarding from the VM to your host)

This. I run docker in WSL. I also do 100% of my development in WSL (for work, anyway). Windows is basically just my web browser.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#76

Post by drzaiusx11 »

Still happily using Colima as a Docker Desktop for Mac replacement. It even allows mixed architecture containers in the same compose stack. What's podman gain me besides a half baked Docker compose implementation?

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#77

Post by leoc »

To bikeshed a little, "Why I Ditched Docker for Podman, And Why You Should Too" would be better than the current headline of "Why I Ditched Docker for Podman (And You Should Too)": the "you should too" part is after all the main message of the article, not a side-point.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#78

Post by t43562 »

nickjj wrote: post #46
t43562 wrote: post #21

To provide 1 contrary opinion to all the others saying they have a problem: Podman rocks for me! I find docker hard to use and full of pitfalls and podman isn't any worse. On the plus side, any company I work for doesn't have to worry about licences. Win win!

> On the plus side, any company I work for doesn't have to worry about licences. Win win! Was this a deal breaker for any company? I ask because the Docker Desktop paid license requirement is quite reasonable. If you have less than 250 employees and make less than $10 million in annual revenue it's free. If you have a dev team of 10 people and are extremely profitable to where you need licenses you'd end up paying $9…

I don't particularly care if it's worth it or not. I don't need to do it. Getting money for things is not easy in all companies.

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#79

Post by manbitesdog »

We where using Podman for certain deployments to AWS recently. However, it was in an EC2 instance and the overhead was unnecesary, so we ended up pasting Bocker[1] to AI, and stripping it of anything unnecesary until leaving just the few isolation features we needed.

[1] https://github.com/p8952/bocker/tree/master

Re: I ditched Docker for Podman

#80

Post by Tajnymag »

bonzini wrote: post #27
Tajnymag wrote: post #11

I've wanted to migrate multiple times. Unfortunately, it failed on multiple places. Firstly, podman had a much worse performance compared to docker on my small cloud vps. Can't really go into details though. Secondly, the development ecosystem isn't really fully there yet. Many tools utilizing Docker via its socket, fail to work reliably with podman. Either because the API differs or because of permission limitations…

> podman had a much worse performance compared to docker on my small cloud vps. Can't really go into details though. Are you using rootless podman? Then network redirection is done using user more networking, which has two modes: slirp4netns is very slow, pasta is the newer and good one. Docker is always set up from the privileged daemon; if you're running podman from the root user there should be no difference.

Well, yes, but rootless is basically the main selling point of podman. Once you start using daemons and privileged containers, you can just keep using docker.
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