Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

corecursive.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 109 posts

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#71

Post by lambdasquirrel »

hollerith wrote: post #28
cmiller1 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My takeaway was that Han's problems were intrinsically tied to the both the architecture and code in ways that made it difficult for others to contribute and fix. The artist's influence on the art caused its ultimate demise.

"Hans's problems".

It’s not just Hans. Who hasn’t known some leading artist who was like this? Or even some former colleague? I’m sure most of us “artsy” types go through some phase like this, but this guy made it his whole life, and never questioned it until it was too late, too little. The art and the artist thing is real.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#72

Post by micahdeath »

dagmx wrote: post #56

The premise of this post is incorrect. ReiserFS stuck around for almost two decades after his crime. The reason it’s being removed has very little to do with his crime and more to do with the stability and maintenance capabilities of it. For reference, his wife was missing in 2006. He was prosecuted in 2008. It was deprecated in 2022 and scheduled to be removed in 2025. How does someone believe that it’s due to his h…

i still use reiserfs - i can store more tiny files than the others. I was disappointed when testing Btrfs as it used more space and became corrupted easier, even when using compression.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#73

Post by jraph »

psychoslave wrote: post #50
ensignavenger wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So once a jerk artist is dead and can no longer benefit from their work, it becomes easier to consume their art without moral concern?

First thing is to differentiate with how long the person is dead. For example, when I accompanied my daughter class to a museum last year, there was a sewed reproduction of the Minotaur by Picasso (the artist exposed was a woman and this was just a collaboration she made with him). To say the least, the history behind the work is not the most glamorous. Would you explain the context to a 7 years class? But Picasso is…

> But Picasso is so close in time, that his direct descendent have financial interest in exploiting the artistic legacy.

I wouldn't be concerned by this specifically. His relatives likely suffered from him being a jerk, I don't mind them at least benefiting from his work. I'm more concerned about Picasso being put on a pedestal.

I don't think I would be against exposing his art with the whole context though.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#74

Post by dagmx »

dijit wrote: post #65
dagmx wrote: post #56

The premise of this post is incorrect. ReiserFS stuck around for almost two decades after his crime. The reason it’s being removed has very little to do with his crime and more to do with the stability and maintenance capabilities of it. For reference, his wife was missing in 2006. He was prosecuted in 2008. It was deprecated in 2022 and scheduled to be removed in 2025. How does someone believe that it’s due to his h…

That's not entirely fair, being included in the trunk of linux for a long time is normal even if something is unused... I know people were avoiding ReiserFS because of its indeterminate future in the backtrack linux 2.0 days (March 2007). It's a cart and horse problem, nobody wants to use it because they think there's no investment, since developing it could be seen outside as being an indemnification of the person.…

I can’t find a reference to a filesystem called AFS. Would you have a link?

As far as I know there was Macintosh File System (MFS) which was replaced by HFS/+ and finally APFS.

But ReiserFS was also infamous for its difficult to maintain nature at the time of its inclusion. Linus himself was against a lot of aspects of it. They capitulated to community pressure to include it, but it was always going to be a project with a high bus factor regardless of his crime.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#75

Post by dijit »

dagmx wrote: post #74
dijit wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not entirely fair, being included in the trunk of linux for a long time is normal even if something is unused... I know people were avoiding ReiserFS because of its indeterminate future in the backtrack linux 2.0 days (March 2007). It's a cart and horse problem, nobody wants to use it because they think there's no investment, since developing it could be seen outside as being an indemnification of the person.…

I can’t find a reference to a filesystem called AFS. Would you have a link? As far as I know there was Macintosh File System (MFS) which was replaced by HFS/+ and finally APFS. But ReiserFS was also infamous for its difficult to maintain nature at the time of its inclusion. Linus himself was against a lot of aspects of it. They capitulated to community pressure to include it, but it was always going to be a project w…

No problem mate, it's a terrible name to google, I understand.

Here it is, the service is called "AFS": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#76

Post by bschne »

adamgordonbell wrote: post #3

Hey, I made this. It uses OpenAI voices for Hans and others, which some found too robotic. The topic on my mind around this was: in the large, like MJ or Woody Allen, it's hard to make a call on the art vs. artist. But in the small, it's much easier because people aren't divided into domains. It's all mixed together. And if you can't work with people, if you can't be a team player you limit your abilities. ReiserFS4…

Detail, but I think this part here is slightly off:

> Fast forward to March 1998. Saint Petersburg. A cafe next to a canal. Hans is meeting a woman. Nina Sharanova. A mail-order bride.

According to his Wikipedia entry, Nina was the interpreter involved when he arranged to meet a mail-order bride:

> In 1998, while working in Saint Petersburg, Russia, Reiser reportedly arranged to meet a Russian woman he selected from a mail-order bride catalog.[15] Five months later, he married the pair's interpreter, Nina Sharanova (Russian: Нина Шаранова).[16]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Reiser

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#77

Post by dagmx »

dijit wrote: post #75
dagmx wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can’t find a reference to a filesystem called AFS. Would you have a link? As far as I know there was Macintosh File System (MFS) which was replaced by HFS/+ and finally APFS. But ReiserFS was also infamous for its difficult to maintain nature at the time of its inclusion. Linus himself was against a lot of aspects of it. They capitulated to community pressure to include it, but it was always going to be a project w…

No problem mate, it's a terrible name to google, I understand. Here it is, the service is called "AFS": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol

Ah the SMB alternative. Okay yes I’m familiar with that.

Unfortunately it was still frequently in use 10 years ago on Apple systems (particularly the time capsule which was only discontinued in 2018) , and there are derivatives in use today. So I’m not sure it’s an apt comparison point.

The Wikipedia article actually links to implementations like netatalk that have updates as recently as a couple months ago. So it is actively maintained beyond what ReiserFS has.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#78

Post by adamgordonbell »

bschne wrote: post #76
adamgordonbell wrote: post #3

Hey, I made this. It uses OpenAI voices for Hans and others, which some found too robotic. The topic on my mind around this was: in the large, like MJ or Woody Allen, it's hard to make a call on the art vs. artist. But in the small, it's much easier because people aren't divided into domains. It's all mixed together. And if you can't work with people, if you can't be a team player you limit your abilities. ReiserFS4…

Detail, but I think this part here is slightly off: > Fast forward to March 1998. Saint Petersburg. A cafe next to a canal. Hans is meeting a woman. Nina Sharanova. A mail-order bride. According to his Wikipedia entry, Nina was the interpreter involved when he arranged to meet a mail-order bride: > In 1998, while working in Saint Petersburg, Russia, Reiser reportedly arranged to meet a Russian woman he selected from…

Interesting! That I did not know. The book didn't present that way, unless I missed something.

Why was a doctor working as a translator I wonder?

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#79

Post by jraph »

RajT88 wrote: post #49

Separating art from artist, I am convinced comes down to your own personal cognitive style. Some can, some cannot. I think all takes are valid and would not try and force my own views on anyone else.

> Some can, some cannot.

Can or want? I don't think it's a question of capability, but a question of conviction. At least for some of us.

Separating or not can have real consequences. The question is what consequences do we prefer?

You are suggesting the status quo. You can do this for any topic, but I don't believe this helps progressing much (of course, you might be uninterested in this, but I could still be interested to show you that you might want to reconsider). If you believe there are concrete consequences, you may want to convince people your way, and this seems valid too.

I agree with not forcing. You can't anyway. But arguing and debating ideas still has value. It can make people change their views, or at least be interesting.

You can't reject someone's idea that the art can be harmful because of the artist as personal preferences or way of thinkingnfor instance. The more interesting thing to do will be to prove them wrong.

Re: ReiserFS and the Art and Artist Problem

#80

Post by wrs »

dagmx wrote: post #74
dijit wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not entirely fair, being included in the trunk of linux for a long time is normal even if something is unused... I know people were avoiding ReiserFS because of its indeterminate future in the backtrack linux 2.0 days (March 2007). It's a cart and horse problem, nobody wants to use it because they think there's no investment, since developing it could be seen outside as being an indemnification of the person.…

I can’t find a reference to a filesystem called AFS. Would you have a link? As far as I know there was Macintosh File System (MFS) which was replaced by HFS/+ and finally APFS. But ReiserFS was also infamous for its difficult to maintain nature at the time of its inclusion. Linus himself was against a lot of aspects of it. They capitulated to community pressure to include it, but it was always going to be a project w…

AFS, the Andrew File System, has kernel support. [0]

AFP, the Apple Filing Protocol, is a network protocol, not a filesystem. It has several userspace implementations. [1]

AFS, the Apple File Service, is AFP plus other auxiliary protocols. [1]

APFS, the Apple File System used in modern MacOS, has read only support in userspace, and there is work on a read/write kernel module that is not mainlined. [2] [4]

HFS, the Hierarchical File System used in older MacOS, has mainline kernel support. [3]

[0] https://docs.kernel.org/filesystems/afs.html

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_File_System

[3] https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/v5.8/filesystems/hfs.html

[4] https://github.com/linux-apfs/linux-apfs-rw

Post reply on HN