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Europe data salary benchmark 2023

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Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#71

Post by Yujf »

mahmoudhossam wrote: post #12
Yujf wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know "the american sense", but benfits are definetely a thing in Belgium. I think like 60+% of engineers get company cars.

I was referring to healthcare which constitutes the bulk of benefits in the US. Also PTO is more regulated in the EU than it is in the US.

Yeah healthcare is for sure better in EU and so less of a benefit, but I still get additional insurance through my company and most white collar jobs do. It's for the extra costs of hospitalisation such as upcharges for a single room and other costs general health care doesn't cover.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#72

Post by Yujf »

Hamuko wrote: post #25
jonasdegendt wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is but at a hilariously cheap rate. It’s pennies on the dollar (or euro, in this case) compared to owning a car outright. It’s a fringe benefit that was invented in order to enable employers to sweeten the pay package without having to straight up pay more, and respectively pay a lot more taxes. We’ve a large bunch of these tax efficient fringe benefits in Belgium but the company car is by far the one that provide…

https://www.politico.eu/article/belgium-company-car-conundru... > Of the 6 million cars on Belgian roads, about 10 percent are company cars. > Even a first job often comes with a car, and most employees also get unlimited fuel cards. That sounds fucking crazy.

Yup, so Belgium has a lot of weird things like that, but it's really hard to take it away since it's such an important part of salary for many people and taxation is really high so most people are very opposed to losing benefits like this.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#73

Post by Yujf »

cscurmudgeon wrote: post #39
Yujf wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know "the american sense", but benfits are definetely a thing in Belgium. I think like 60+% of engineers get company cars.

> I think like 60+% of engineers get company cars. Honest question: How useful is when we frequently hear that Europe doesn't use cars as much as in the US? I can't fathom someone in a major European city finding much use for a car.

Very usefull. Many people live outside the city centers (which are very small in Belgium) and use cars to commute.

Public transport is relatively good within a city, but if you come from outside the city it can get really bad. 20 min by car can be 1 hour by bus for example.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#74

Post by MichaelRo »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #70
MichaelRo wrote: post #68

The figures are inflated because they focus on outliers. The vast majority of employers in EU are plain boring companies, telekom, industrial, automotive, and products that have a market but not that of Google, Facebook, Amazon. There's little difference between the salary of a software developer and that of a teacher or police officer, developers in EU here are less of a privileged caste isolated in their hundreds o…

>I myself live in Eastern Europe and make €60,000 per year gross That's a very good salary for Romania. Can I ask your seniority level. DO you work for a company on a local employment contract or freelance for outside remote companies?

Yes, it's in the high range, but I have 20+ years of software development experience, C++ and quantitative finance although I only do the former now because I was getting the same money as doing just development and working twice , with the latter being particularly nasty stuff. Also Java and lately Kotlin (Android).

The €60k are on local employment contract. Besides that I get the odd remote freelance contract, usually because of my trading and quant finance domain knowledge.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#75

Post by woobar »

emptysongglass wrote: post #35
woobar wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. You like your social safety net? You like stronger worker protection? Long vacations? Someone has to pay for all of it. Either through higher taxes or lower wages.

I have to take out salary insurance because welfare benefits wouldn't even begin to cover living expenses. You have such a thing in the US too. In Denmark, it's easy to fire and easy to hire (let at hyre og fyre [1]) so what am I liking here? At US Google I understand it's 30 days paid time off a calendar year: that's the same standard as Europe. Yet Google will happily pay the same role less than half when hired her…

You are comparing outliners (big tech with huge salaries and outstanding benefits) with every employer in Western(?) Europe. How much does it cost to provide 6 weeks of vacation to everyone in the country? The senior engineer in Europe will have to support more people through taxes.

The market rates are lower because there is no market. FTA I only recognize one European company with somewhat global reach (booking.com). Europe doesn't have multiple companies trying risky businesses and competing for the top talent. European values (focus on equality, stability, WLB, etc) are in part responsible for this.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#76

Post by woobar »

retrac98 wrote: post #56
woobar wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't have your cake and eat it too. You like your social safety net? You like stronger worker protection? Long vacations? Someone has to pay for all of it. Either through higher taxes or lower wages.

“Social safety net” 14% of people in UK are skipping meals because they can’t afford food right now. https://theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/18/one-in-7-briton...

I am not sure what are you trying to say. Your link says people in need are getting energy subsidies and direct payments. Do you believe that the number of people skipping meals will be lower without the safety net?

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#77

Post by woobar »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #67
KptMarchewa wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's mainly lack of single consumer market, and the markets being too small to meaningfully start B2C companies.

You mean like Spotify, that started in the large and populous country of Sweden?

GP was talking about companies with FAANG levels of profitability. Maybe we should bring up Spotify when they are profitable. [1]

[1] https://www.wallstreetzen.com/stocks/us/nyse/spot/earnings

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#78

Post by MrBuddyCasino »

woobar wrote: post #77
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean like Spotify, that started in the large and populous country of Sweden?

GP was talking about companies with FAANG levels of profitability. Maybe we should bring up Spotify when they are profitable. [1] [1] https://www.wallstreetzen.com/stocks/us/nyse/spot/earnings

You got me there.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#79

Post by retrac98 »

woobar wrote: post #76
retrac98 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Social safety net” 14% of people in UK are skipping meals because they can’t afford food right now. https://theguardian.com/politics/2022/oct/18/one-in-7-briton...

I am not sure what are you trying to say. Your link says people in need are getting energy subsidies and direct payments. Do you believe that the number of people skipping meals will be lower without the safety net?

No. I’m saying the social safety net is inadequate.

Re: Europe data salary benchmark 2023

#80

Post by pokepim »

MichaelRo wrote: post #68

The figures are inflated because they focus on outliers. The vast majority of employers in EU are plain boring companies, telekom, industrial, automotive, and products that have a market but not that of Google, Facebook, Amazon. There's little difference between the salary of a software developer and that of a teacher or police officer, developers in EU here are less of a privileged caste isolated in their hundreds o…

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