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Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

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Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#71
post #8

It would be nice if we could find what triggers the body's improved condition when doing exercise, and trigger it maximally without having to do hours of repetitive nonsense. It's fine if you like to do it, but a lot of us obviously don't. I wonder how the progress is going in this sphere.

I'd suggest, from experience, that maybe doing "hours of repetitive nonsense" is what triggers it maximally.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#72
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can’t outrun a bad diet. It takes a lot of exercise to burn off excess calories, and virtually no effort to simply not consume them. I understand that health is more than just calories, and you can come to the same conclusion about other bad things like trans fats, alcohol, etc. If someone had to choose only one thing to do for health, a healthy diet is far more important than exercise.

While you can't easily burn off excess calories, a good amount of muscle mass can significantly increase your metabolic rate as well, so there are effects from repeated exercise beyond just calorie consumption.

Citation needed because “significantly”. Studies I have seen in this (not my field) indicate that the effect is measurable, but basically negligible.

The ancestor comment saying to do cardio is right. Strength training is also important for health, but for different reasons (motor function, bone density, etc.). The act of strength training also burns some calories, regardless of resultant muscle mass.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there are edge cases that deserve sympathy but they don't represent the bulk of scenarios. You say this, but you also say, "Most of that 70% has enough control of these factors to reap their benefits" 70% and "most of 70%" are still either a majority or at the very least a plurality; so, I have to strongly disagree that they don't represent the bulk of the scenarios. Is your argument that most people are lazy and s…

> Is your argument that most people are lazy Yes most adults are extremely lazy and undisciplined.

>Yes most adults are extremely lazy and undisciplined.

If you do not believe this statement, ask the opinion of any medical provider you know.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#74

Diet, exercise, enough sleep, and a good social support structure are pretty much the keys to good health in general. The fact that we have so many health issues in western society are because its so easy to neglect these things.

And you don't need a gym membership or expensive equipment or any training for exercise. Even a tiny amount can make a huge difference. If you're currently doing no exercise, try to walk five minutes at lunch time each day. Just five minutes. And when that's trivial to do, make it 10 minutes. Try to keep increasing this over the year. No rush. Take your time. But try to make it a habit. Even if some days it's back do…

A lot of people don't realize that muscle use helps pump blood. Movement is important for helping circulation.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most of that 70% has enough control of these factors to reap their benefits And yet they don't, so it suggests to me that "it's not that simple". It's better to imagine that people _are_ doing what they can and it's still not enough, so rather than victim blaming, we can discover what's actually going on in these people's lives that's stopping their ability to reach it. Are they so downtrodden that it's not worth t…

I think for a lot of people it is that simple. Doing what’s right for your health is more difficult and requires sacrifice. Dopamine is easy to get from doom scrolling on your phone, watching Netflix, or playing video games. You don’t even have to leave your chair. Exercise is hard. It requires you to exert yourself and it requires training over time to see tangible results. Same thing with food. Going through a McDo…

Our economic system has engrained in us that if you aren't doing your competitive advantage money earner, it's better to outsource that to someone who does.

That's extended to all facets of life and has bought us a lot of luxury time, which of course has led to a rise in dopamine factory applications, goods, and services to fill that time.

Many people honestly believe "why would i spend time grocery shopping if i can just pay someone else to cook for me?"

There's something to be said for the effort of doing things.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#76
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don’t forget all the evidence suggesting adult neurogenesis specifically from running. As for VO2max, Levitt had a longevity researcher on his podcast who found that a high VO2max (used as a proxy measure) is causally related with higher impacts on 5 year all cause mortality than smoking. In the good direction. As in: being in shape reduces your risk of death more than smoking increases it. Sauce: https://freakonomic…

Figured that would be Peter Attia. https://peterattiamd.com/podcast/ His podcast is amazing but can be dense and technical at times. He's evidence based and would probably fit in with the HN crowd.

I enjoy listening to Attia talk about his longevity research. He's why I finally started doing IF, and someone I looked to when I moved from power lifting (can't do it forever lol) to a more longevity based exercise program.

Then I randomly got really into jiu-jitsu because why not.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#78
When I was undergoing chemotherapy to treat Hodgkin's lymphoma, I tried to keep up some exercise but it was just too difficult. I ended up needing to take a drug to boost my white blood cell production so that treatment could continue. White blood cells are produced in your bones and this drug made it feel like every bone in your body was broken. It was awful.

Had I known this at the time, I probably would've forced myself to ride my indoor stationary bike every day if it would've helped avoid that immune booster drug.

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#79
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they return to baseline in 30 minutes, was there even an increase to begin with? What is the mean lifetime of those cytotoxic cells, and would one expect such a decay in so short a time? I understand that it is a very dynamic system but 30 minutes seems very short to me. So is the return a die-off or where do they go?

The lifespan of T cells varies from months to years (memory T cells). T cell development begins in the bone marrow and continues in the lymphatic tissue and periphery. During their lifespan, these cells circulate in the body and migrate based on chemical gradients. What happens when you exercise? Blood pressure increases, blood vessels dilate. I honestly would not be surprised if what these authors observed was just…

Excellent explanation, thanks.

That seems to translate well to my layman intuition. Would there actually be a health benefit with respect to cancer (or pathogenic disease) from this "T cell migration"? Is there a sense in which migration of T cells spread information to different parts of the body or is this just not how it works?

Re: Exercise increases number of immune cells in cancer patients

#80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Beans, rice, eggs and oats are cheaper, healthier and quicker than Mcdonalds. (Rice is not quicker). If McDonals were the only choice they wouldn't be spending millions on advertising.

They're also more emotionally taxing to create, and come with several externalities that aren't baked in to the price of the dollar menu: * dish washing (do they even have dishes?) * power usage of stove * time to clean up * a singular, large lump of time to go out and buy all those food * the necessary mental spoons to plan those numerous meals each week * a refridgerator that works (mine is currently broken, for ex…

  * a refridgerator that works (mine is currently broken, for example)
Other than eggs, and this is in the US not all countries, you don't need a refrigerator for the listed items. Beans, rice, and oats do not require refrigeration. Many fruits and vegetables also don't need refrigeration [0].

  * a willingness to accept the cost of losing a lot of food when the fridge inevitably breaks
This is mitigated by learning what does and does not need to be refrigerated and storing things properly.

[0] https://extension.purdue.edu/foodlink/includes/pubs/Storing%...

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