What a gas stove ban means for restaurants • Hacker News Board

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#71

Post by ajsnigrutin » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:52 PM UTC

D13Fd wrote: post #55

bitxbitxbitcoin wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the age old false dichotomy between personal use (minuscule percentage of green house gasses) versus agricultural/commercial use (the actual elephant in the room).

“Minuscule” or not, it doesn’t matter. Every molecule of CO2 & other greenhouse gases avoided now is worth dozens or hundreds or more that we’ll have to recapture via carbon capture in the future if we want to prevent a climate disaster.

Imagine a some shady company building a dam, and due to their shitty practices the dam failed, there's a huge flood destroying whole cities, and you're blaming the person above you, because he pissed in the water. Yes, technically every mililiter of liquid matters, but we all know who the real culprit is, and shifting the blame to someone who likes good food, instead of the major puluters is a bad thing to do.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#72

Post by AlgorithmicTime » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:52 PM UTC

zionic wrote: post #64

breadloaf wrote: post #44

I always find laughable when governments are scolding or limiting peasants for basically nothing, while ignoring the elephant in the room. * You need to conserve the water, California peasant! Ignore the fact that 80% of water in California is consumed by agriculture and we are not going to do anything about it. * You need to stop using your gas stove, peasant! Ignore the fact that we are going to switch off Diablo N…

gas stoves vent toxic fumes into the house, run the risk of blowing your house up, and are inferior to induction stoves in almost every way. Any time this comes up I love to singe the praises of induction!

Induction stoves are seriously inferior to gas, in every way.

They are slower to heat.

They are more expensive to operate.

They are more fragile.

They rely on complex electronics vs. simple mechanics.

They require specific cookware made out of only certain materials.

They require direct contact with the "burner" to work.

In what possible way are they superior?

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#73

Post by forum_ghost » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:53 PM UTC

D13Fd wrote: post #56

throwaway27727 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you really want to optimize for the long term, obtaining goodwill by not making the forced habit changes first would be better.

That doesn’t obtain goodwill, it just delays the inevitable while we continue putting these gases into the atmosphere.

Populations of insects have collapsed, fish stocks have collapsed, biosphere is polluted by millions of tons of forever chemicals dumped into the Pacific ever year. Chemicals that keep accumulating in every life form.

Earlier puberty in girls by several years, lower testosterone in men by more than 50% in two generation. Intersex fish. Some species are even reproducing asexually which for some was thought impossible.

This is NOW. TODAY.

CO2 has become such a convenient misdirection device that the industry uses to keep your attention away from rather current things that can very well implode life as we know it well before any "climate problems" actually become disruptive as these all other pollutants are today.

Why else do you think Exxon is rated 100% ESG compliant? Yes! They bought some credits or whatever, but still dump a few million tons of actual pollutants that destroy life TODAY.

Just keep everyone spinning on the carbon hamster wheels.

It's the green way.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#74

Post by cpwright » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:53 PM UTC

ars wrote: post #4

This is such a foolish law, environmentally speaking. I totally understand doing this once we've phased out burning natural gas for electricity. But we are not there today, today we are burning natural gas for electricity. So using electricity instead of natural gas in your home is wasteful. And yes I'm well aware that induction stoves are a thing. But induction stoves of today cannot run all four burners and the sto…

If you're worried about gas usage, the stove seems to be the wrong place to care as well. We use propane for our stove, which comes to somewhere in the neighborhood of $100/year (If you want to have the most effect on usage, you'll worry about space heating not cooking. As long as your home is warm, you don't care. My wife specifically wanted gas for the stove instead of electric when we redid the kitchen, so we went through the effort to get propane.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#75

Post by krallja » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:54 PM UTC

ars wrote: post #28

mbrock wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn’t that just a series hybrid?

Yes, that's exactly what that is, and apparently there are none for sale. There must be a reason why not, but I don't know what it is.

Chevy had one called the Volt, but ended production in 2019.

From Wikipedia:

“In 2018, General Motors decided to end production in March 2019. The primary reason given was that the Volt is a sedan, and sales of traditional sedans were in decline. Car salesmen were proving resistant to selling the car because it was more complicated (and thus took more of their time) to explain how the vehicle operated. Marketing trends showed that sales of hybrids were dropping as more customers were turning to all-electric vehicles like the Chevrolet Bolt. The range-anxiety associated with all-electric vehicles had been in decline due to better battery technology, and most hybrid drivers were turning on their gas-powered engines less frequently. The battery technology developed for the Volt had already been incorporated into the Bolt.”

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#76

Post by throwaway4aday » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:54 PM UTC

zionic wrote: post #64

breadloaf wrote: post #44

I always find laughable when governments are scolding or limiting peasants for basically nothing, while ignoring the elephant in the room. * You need to conserve the water, California peasant! Ignore the fact that 80% of water in California is consumed by agriculture and we are not going to do anything about it. * You need to stop using your gas stove, peasant! Ignore the fact that we are going to switch off Diablo N…

gas stoves vent toxic fumes into the house, run the risk of blowing your house up, and are inferior to induction stoves in almost every way. Any time this comes up I love to singe the praises of induction!

> are inferior to induction stoves in almost every way

the one way in which they surpass induction stoves is the only thing that counts, instant control of the heat applied to the pan.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#77

Post by mynameisash » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:54 PM UTC

taylodl wrote: post #59

breadloaf wrote: post #44

I always find laughable when governments are scolding or limiting peasants for basically nothing, while ignoring the elephant in the room. * You need to conserve the water, California peasant! Ignore the fact that 80% of water in California is consumed by agriculture and we are not going to do anything about it. * You need to stop using your gas stove, peasant! Ignore the fact that we are going to switch off Diablo N…

Ignore the fact that we are going to switch off Diablo Nuclear Power plant and replace it with gas plants. That's a bit disingenuous. Those units were brought online in 1985 and 1986 and are licensed to operate through 2025. That's forty years - which is the life span of a power plant, especially a nuclear power plant. So, they're not being "switched off", they've hit end-of-life. Building a new nuclear power station…

> Those units ... are licensed to operate through 2025. ... So, they're not being "switched off", they've hit end-of-life

But that's not necessarily accurate, either. My dad worked in the nuclear industry all his career and specifically within the licensing group for maybe five or ten years. His job was, for a time, to relicense the plant that he worked at so they could continue after their 40 year initial licensure period.

Maybe Diablo happens to be end of life due to other issues, but saying that the license is up is not the same as it being end of life.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#78

Post by nsxwolf » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:54 PM UTC

SenHeng wrote: post #12

Lots of Korean bbq (yakiniku) restaurants in Japan have shifted to electric hot plates over the last decade. It's honestly a more comfortable experience, no more hot air rushing over your face, or cooking your wrist while turning some meat over.

I like to see the flames.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#79

Post by krallja » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:56 PM UTC

ars wrote: post #19

spacemanmatt wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone wired 120 amps to just my stove. I think my A/C is the only other circuit that fat. House is a "builder" model I estimate is about 1 in 10 or 15 around here, from the 1980s.

120amp to your stove? What in the world does the plug look like? I've never seen a plug that big, except with 3-phase.

NEMA doesn’t define a plug that big, so it would have to be hard-wired, and probably has a cutoff switch.

Re: What a gas stove ban means for restaurants

#80

Post by erellsworth » Fri, Jun 03, 2022, 4:57 PM UTC

D13Fd wrote: post #55

bitxbitxbitcoin wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the age old false dichotomy between personal use (minuscule percentage of green house gasses) versus agricultural/commercial use (the actual elephant in the room).

“Minuscule” or not, it doesn’t matter. Every molecule of CO2 & other greenhouse gases avoided now is worth dozens or hundreds or more that we’ll have to recapture via carbon capture in the future if we want to prevent a climate disaster.

No post body was provided.