Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration • Hacker News Board

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#71

Post by rdwallis » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 12:55 PM UTC

jsiepkes wrote: post #24

Can someone explain to me what use case I'm missing? Why do people care about old messages? Personally I just read incoming message and never "scroll back".

I used my whatsapp chat history to successfully contest a traffic fine.

My parents wanted me to check on their house while they were away. I messaged them on whatsapp when I left my house and then again when I arrived at theirs.

A month or so after my trip I was sent a fine for not displaying my car license while my car was parked on a public road. I had driven down the road where the fine was recorded during the trip. Using the timestamps of the whatsapp messages I was able to show that there was not enough time during my trip for me to have stopped to park.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#72

Post by WilTimSon » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:00 PM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #10

telesilla wrote: post #9

Anyone know how to get their elderly parents to switch? Whatsapp has us cornered and they know it.

It isn't harder to use than Whatsapp. It's actually simpler, because it has less useless bells and whistles. All you need to do is convince them that it's for their good, if they can agree on that then the technicality isn't difficult.

It is a bit harder to use but, what's more important, not as feature-rich and doesn't have literal billions of users. We are looking at the issue of getting someone to switch selfishly, convinced it's about them not being able to figure things out. Instead, it might be that they want a more polished app or one that has all of their contacts, not just us.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#73

Post by The_Colonel » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:04 PM UTC

robjan wrote: post #21

bildung wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the group chats in Signal are encrypted.

The only disadvantage is that Signal reveals the phone number of other group participants. Of course everyone could use burner numbers but, in practice, that's not very likely.

In many countries you can't get burner number since every SIM must be registered with your ID.

This phone number requirement is the biggest letdown ...

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#74

Post by berkes » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:05 PM UTC

Spearchucker wrote: post #67

berkes wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this here as a 'first step'. The second step either upstream integrating it, or it becoming an own app on the appstores.

Please not the latter. There are sooo many apps out there where you wonder if it's a honeypot, has more or less functionality, or is a completely different product. All because the name is similar, and the app icon the same or imperceptibly different.

I doo don't hope that is the "solution" that will arise, but it also depends on the willingness and ability of Signal to include it.

There is demand. If (for legal, security or UX reasons) Signal cannot offer a solution to that demand, others will step in.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#75

Post by upofadown » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:08 PM UTC

w1nk wrote: post #35

notorandit wrote: post #30

What went wrong with XMPP and federated servers?

XMPP never got its story together for mobile clients. Sure there are some configurations of XEPs that will eventually allow you a reasonable configuration that supports multi device, history, media, etc, but for whatever reason, gluing those pieces together into something sane has evaded our community.

In particular it never got its story together for iOS. ... and macOS more recently. It is quite good, on say, Android (Conversations). Rumour has it that XMPP is a lot more popular in parts of the world where Apple stuff is less popular. Those tens of thousands of XMPP servers are probably in those parts of the world.

There is an active project working to improve things on the Apple side:

* https://monal.im/

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#76

Post by raghav_nautiyal » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:11 PM UTC

Is it possible for signal to act like a chat client, and allow its users to send messages via Signal to someone using WhatsApp? Not sure what protocol WhatsApp and Signal use to send messages - was just wondering since most Email clients do this using SMTP.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#77

Post by Y-bar » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:13 PM UTC

chupchap wrote: post #25

jsiepkes wrote: post #24

Can someone explain to me what use case I'm missing? Why do people care about old messages? Personally I just read incoming message and never "scroll back".

Messages are not always transactional right? They can also be emotional and heartfelt. Some people like to revist such messages.

This is me. It's like the old shoe-box of postcards which is in the attic a year or two at a time. I still keep an old device with messages from someone whom I will never meet again. It is emotional and I sometimes reminisce by charging the device and scroll through the messages.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#78

Post by MattJ100 » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:13 PM UTC

upofadown wrote: post #75

w1nk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

XMPP never got its story together for mobile clients. Sure there are some configurations of XEPs that will eventually allow you a reasonable configuration that supports multi device, history, media, etc, but for whatever reason, gluing those pieces together into something sane has evaded our community.

In particular it never got its story together for iOS. ... and macOS more recently. It is quite good, on say, Android (Conversations). Rumour has it that XMPP is a lot more popular in parts of the world where Apple stuff is less popular. Those tens of thousands of XMPP servers are probably in those parts of the world. There is an active project working to improve things on the Apple side: * https://monal.im/

Monal is active and improving, but I think Siskin has a slight edge right now: https://siskin.im/ (Siskin's macOS sibling is https://beagle.im/ ).

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#79

Post by jl6 » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:14 PM UTC

Is something like this possible but in reverse? Not to migrate to WhatsApp, but to export data from Signal to a neutral environment (text file, zip file, database, whatever). I can’t switch to Signal until this becomes possible.

Re: Signal Fork with WhatsApp Migration

#80

Post by mkmk2 » Tue, Jan 12, 2021, 1:16 PM UTC

raghav_nautiyal wrote: post #76

Is it possible for signal to act like a chat client, and allow its users to send messages via Signal to someone using WhatsApp? Not sure what protocol WhatsApp and Signal use to send messages - was just wondering since most Email clients do this using SMTP.

I wouldn't expect a project like that to go too far, I know of a couple of oss whatsapp clients that got took down, I'd assume when such a component comes online facebook would start causing trouble for them. Matrix uses bots which bridges services with services like signal, that seems to be the easiest way to achieve inter-operability, though idk how usable it is in practice.