Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds • Hacker News Board

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#71

Post by davidsong » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:34 PM UTC

giarc wrote: post #17

This has been known for quite a while, basically passing through the non sterile vaginal canal vs the sterile (or close to it) abdominal wall yields differences. This has lead to some questionable practices such as "vaginal seeding" whereby new moms will swab their vagina and then seed their babies shortly after birth (usually through placing the gauze in babies mouth or around their face). This comes up not infreque…

This is about gut bacteria and debunks the practice of vaginal seeding. I remember my friend and father of five crudely telling an expectant mother that "first comes the poo, then comes the baby" and thinking he was joking until I saw it for myself.

This discovery will likely lead to a surge of people intentionally shitting on newborns.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#72

Post by eT8AZithxooKei6 » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:36 PM UTC

iyw wrote: post #66

User23 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HPV can cause mouth and throat cancer[1]. [1] https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/sexual-health/can-oral-sex-give...

So that would be HPV causing cancer. Not cunnilingus. If you are insinuating that the transmission of HPV is through cunnilingus then fine. But stating a direct causation is careless.

So that would be the impact causing injury. Not stepping in front of a car. If you are insinuating that the impact was caused by stepping in front of a car then fine. But stating a direct causation is careless.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#73

Post by mcbuilder » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:43 PM UTC

refurb wrote: post #69

The biggest question that surround all this microbiome discussion is - does the difference even matter? Note that you can significantly alter your gut microbiome simply by changes to your diet. Right now the link between the microbiome and allergies is tenuous at best.

My understanding is that yes environment makes a huge difference in your biome, however there may be strains of bacteria, for example, that you would only get from your mother. Maybe something she picked up playing in the dirt in a different country, or maybe something from her mother.

Whether it makes a difference really depends on the individual. Personally I think it's better to get the gut bacteria that you can from your mother near the time of birth, but that's me.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#74

Post by alanh » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:47 PM UTC

irrational wrote: post #47

Syzygies wrote: post #40

Many of us Caesarian babies didn't get "vaginal seeding" at birth, but have been trying to catch up ever since.

You joke, and are being downvoted, but I had never ever thought about cunnilingus affecting ones gut biome. Is that ridiculous or even possible?

not ridiculous — it leads to higher chances of throat cancer, tragically, thanks to certain viruses being picked up in this manner. (I know, viruses and bacteria are not the same, but they share transmission vectors)

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#75

Post by alanh » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:49 PM UTC

refurb wrote: post #70

amelius wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Farm kids are healthiest Why can't we just buy some farm dirt in pill form?

Coronado Biosciences tried to treat Crohn's disease using hookworm eggs. Basically give the patient a bunch of eggs, the hook worms hatch, cause an immune response, then die (as they can’t live in humans). Clinical trial showed no impact at all on the disease.

I think you mean to say they can't, but… they can https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/hookworm/gen_info/faqs.html

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#76

Post by tptacek » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:50 PM UTC

bdamm wrote: post #64

tptacek wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is apparently one of the better-studied questions about immunization, and the verdict is that multiple simultaneous vaccinations does not increase the risk of side effects.

Then we need to start studying how to help parents have a better experience when vaccinating their children. The fact is that, as a parent, it's unsettling to watch a doctor pump vial after vial into your kid. Even immediately after birth, I remember there was a big vial they injected into my son. If the patient had been an adult it would have been like injecting an entire tumbler full of serum. There's a bit of a gu…

I don't know. I did it with two kids and it didn't bug me a bit. Really, I felt pretty good about it. It's one of those parenting merit badge moments.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#77

Post by tptacek » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:51 PM UTC

kazinator wrote: post #62

tptacek wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is apparently one of the better-studied questions about immunization, and the verdict is that multiple simultaneous vaccinations does not increase the risk of side effects.

Surely, that depends on how you frame it? Tossing three coins doesn't increase the odds of any one of them being heads, surely enough. But tossing them at the same time as a single combined trial, instead of just one coin, does increase the odds of at least one heads showing up from 50 to 87.5%. Of course, you're going to have all those vaccines anyway and so the odds are the same overall for those administrations. J…

Once again, the question of whether multiple simultaneous vaccinations increases adverse effects is well studied, and the verdict is that they do not. It doesn't seem to me like trying to reason to the contrary axiomatically is going to get you anywhere.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#78

Post by refurb » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:57 PM UTC

alanh wrote: post #75

refurb wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coronado Biosciences tried to treat Crohn's disease using hookworm eggs. Basically give the patient a bunch of eggs, the hook worms hatch, cause an immune response, then die (as they can’t live in humans). Clinical trial showed no impact at all on the disease.

I think you mean to say they can't, but… they can https://www.cdc.gov/parasites/hookworm/gen_info/faqs.html

I did mean “can’t”.

Coronado used porcine (pig) hookworm eggs that’s can’t complete a reproductive cycle in humans.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#79

Post by refurb » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 10:59 PM UTC

mcbuilder wrote: post #73

refurb wrote: post #69

The biggest question that surround all this microbiome discussion is - does the difference even matter? Note that you can significantly alter your gut microbiome simply by changes to your diet. Right now the link between the microbiome and allergies is tenuous at best.

My understanding is that yes environment makes a huge difference in your biome, however there may be strains of bacteria, for example, that you would only get from your mother. Maybe something she picked up playing in the dirt in a different country, or maybe something from her mother. Whether it makes a difference really depends on the individual. Personally I think it's better to get the gut bacteria that you can f…

If you were to test the microbiome of a family, you’d find they are very similar. Humans living in close quarters exchange biomes readily (oral - fecal transmission).

I’m certainly not arguing there is no impact of the microbiome on disease, but right now the data is far to early to say anything conclusively.

Re: Caesarean babies have different gut bacteria, microbiome study finds

#80

Post by primroot » Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 11:02 PM UTC

> “In many cases, a caesarean is a life-saving procedure and can be the right choice for a woman and her baby,”

And in other cases it is a way to make life easier for medical staff?

Here in Panama, babies are disproportionately born through C-section in privately run hospitals.

Update: While I can't cite any stats for Panama, there is an article [0] that says

"The rates can be even higher in private clinics. For example, in Brazil, 80-90 percent of births in private clinics are now C-sections, compared with about 30-40 percent of births in public hospitals."

[0] https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2018/10/12/6561984...