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Breaking a WoW addiction

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Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#71
post #5

Caveat: it's very easy to extend the criticism of WoW to life itself. Working all these years to be a paramedic, going to school, going to work, for what? To drive some people to the hospital? They're all just going to die anyway. Life is meaningless! What the author is really saying is: "I find more meaning in the real world than in WoW." But this isn't necessarily true for everyone. Having said all that, I think WO…

Why the fuck are you getting upvotes? Your hijacking of the points and arguments he makes doesn't even warrant a response.

http://ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#72
post #5

Caveat: it's very easy to extend the criticism of WoW to life itself. Working all these years to be a paramedic, going to school, going to work, for what? To drive some people to the hospital? They're all just going to die anyway. Life is meaningless! What the author is really saying is: "I find more meaning in the real world than in WoW." But this isn't necessarily true for everyone. Having said all that, I think WO…

I wasted a heap of time on WoW as a teenager, certainly I could't seen myself doing that now but looking back I can't say I have bad memories of those years. Could have I been doing something more productive? Probably. But would have it gave me the same level of enjoyment? Questionable.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#73
An article about the psychology of gaming which I found quite interesting:

http://ifat-glassman.blogspot.com/2009/11/work-games-and-sel...

Personally I'm finding my interest in games is waining. A whole bunch of very impressive AAA games came out this year - in the past I would have played all of them, this year I only played Bad Company 2 and Halo Reach. I think I no longer have the time/energy to make that initial investment in a game, where you jump through a bunch of frustrating hoops until the fun starts and/or you feel immersed in the game world. However, I still enjoy the competition online - outsmarting other humans in a game of skill and strategy. So I play Bad Company 2 on Live frequently, but I don't pursue the social component of it (friendlists, clans etc). I'm not sure if I'll ever get bored of that.

And for that reason I avoid WoW like the plague: endless human competition, massive social aspect. Bound to be addictive (mind you, i'm not sure what you actually do in WoW gameplay. the adverts are all cutscenes)

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#74
Good read. I'd like to add that a lot of the good parts of WoW, (PvP, Social Interaction, Character Customization) have equal or better equivalents in other games that take up far less time. League of Legends, Call of Duty, Counterstrike, Warcraft/Starcraft can all easily be played with friends and in moderation.

Devils Advocate:

Who are we to say what a "real" accomplishment is. Maybe spending 6-8 hrs in a virtual world every day makes that world real to someone. If that world becomes reality then goals met in the virtual world are real accomplishments to them. In the grand scheme of things isn't life just trying to be happy killing time until we die. If I go to the gym every day but spend most of my life miserable is my life any more fulfilling than someone who spends 8hrs a day playing WoW and loving it?

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#75

What WoW needs to do is start hooking in-game rewards to real-life rewards. For example, a deal with 24 Hour Fitness where you need to attend for 30 days in a row to unlock some kind of sword. The biometric system at 24 Hour is now sophisticated enough to permit this kind of tracking [with your permission of course]. I'm completely serious. This is an inversion of the Zynga model in which real life money is exchanged…

I love the idea, but why does WoW need to do this? Any game could do it. A fitness club is especially well-placed to accomplish it.

Hmm... I think it could also work well as a Facebook app.

I'm going to mull this over and see what I can come up with. This could really drive society to improve itself in all kinds of ways.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#76
It seems like the problem is the addiction. The author seems to acknowledge this is the title, but goes on to mostly treat WOW or gaming addiction like it is semi-unique. Granted, blizzard intentionally includes many elements that are more or less designed for addiction (quite common in the industry/genre) and that intention is troubling.

But otherwise it does seem like it shares a lot of traits with other addictions. You can waste your life away watching TV, playing games, shooting heroin, blogging, gambling, refreshing facebook, whatever. To be sure certain of those tasks seem much more likely to lead to addiction (warcraft/heroin) but it's clearly not the only factor.

There is also the question of whether addiction can be a pre-existing condition more or less waiting to go off. I am far from a psychologist, but I know that drug addicts often suffer from depression or other mental problems and it seems likely that instead of the drugs causing them, at least some times it was the condition that lead to the drugs (though I'm sure they become heavily intertwined). Are WOW addicts more likely to be depressed or agoraphobic? It seems quite possible. Would they have all developed this because of the game? I don't know.

I would like to see the industry self police itself a little better. Online games may always be addictive, but are lots of "brain hacks" intentionally being used by the genre to extend lifetime engagement. They're easiest to see in the more transparent copies - Zynga, foursquare, xbox live achievements. Maybe they should need to cut the most manipulative of these out or suffer chinese style regulation. We do, after all, try to shield kids from alcohol and tobacco.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What enables him? Why can he keep playing and not have to worry about paying rent or having enough money for food? I play quite a lot of videogames, and I play wow, but I'm a grown-up, I have a job, I have a home, I buy my own food, I pay my mortgage, and if I fail at my job, I'll starve and lose my home and my ability to play videogames. Why hasn't your friend come to the same realization?

You picked home ownership and you pick food according to your income. If you fail at your job you will starve and loose your home because you entangled your burdens with your paycheck. Perhaps his friend choses food and roof far cheaper then he could afford in order to have more time to spend freely not on paying for those.

His wife supports him.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#78
Game makers (and some website owners) are discovering what some religious and cult leaders have known for thousands of years: you don't have to give somebody a drug to make them an addict. People are perfectly capable of generating their own addictions without external chemical help.

I _think_ what's going to happen is that we come up with a new moral code -- much like the thing where drinking before a certain time was considered bad, or the idea of doctors prescribing pain pills for themselves anathema.

But really, it beats me. We have a generation of people addicted to a sedentary activity in a way that's never happened in human history. It's very difficult to predict how all this will play out.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#79
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Is playing a social game where you interact with other people any different than going out to a club or bar? Joining a bowling league? A cycling group? A health clubwhere you go to regular group exercise classes?" The article makes the difference abundantly clear. This is what the writer learned by meeting the guild leader in real life: "She was perfectly nice, and an excellent cook. But it was hard not to notice ce…

So it is preferable to participate in real life instead of game because it is uglier?

Er... no. That's not it at all. I'm baffled how you could have read that into the quote.

The point is that World of Warcraft was taking all the time & energy that could have went into improving her life, and that she besides not on any sort of growth trajectory, may well have been getting worse - that she wasn't investing even the minimum necessary to keep her life (such as it was) viable.

Re: Breaking a WoW addiction

#80
post #5

Caveat: it's very easy to extend the criticism of WoW to life itself. Working all these years to be a paramedic, going to school, going to work, for what? To drive some people to the hospital? They're all just going to die anyway. Life is meaningless! What the author is really saying is: "I find more meaning in the real world than in WoW." But this isn't necessarily true for everyone. Having said all that, I think WO…

It's easy to extend to life at a macro level, but it breaks down pretty quickly.

First, it's a bit more akin to life if you were a serf in medieval times where your whole life is a repetitive task to serve the local landowner (ie. Blizzard).

More importantly, WoW reduces rewards to regular, metered system which I believe is damaging to self-motivation.

There are no experiences in WoW that are unique, there is no unexplored territory, and no accomplishment you can achieve that wasn't predetermined by a designer.

It's tempting to make a philosophical analogy, but there's a major difference. If we are brains in vats we have no choice in the matter; but choosing WoW means choosing an experience in a constrained world, completely devoid of any of the nuance of the physical world, despite the quantity of shiny objects.

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