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Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

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Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#71

Post by majkinetor »

mb_72 wrote: post #65
majkinetor wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What can I say, it works for me and few more people I know. But the argument you are giving is quite pointless - vitamin C has no side effects and it is dead cheap so there is no harm in trying it out for several months and deciding on your own if its good or not for you.

> What can I say, it works for me and few more people I know. You don't know that - it could have been other unknown factors that made the difference. The same claims of 'working' are made for homoeopathy etc. In general 'trying stuff' is a waste of effort, time and money unless there is supporting evidence for efficacy.

You really can never know for sure, vitamin C or whatever. Many many drugs are used in mainstream medicine without clear proof or mechanism of action.

If you have a real problem to solve effort and money may be irrelevant. It was for me. I had 5 times a year common cold up until i did vit C thing.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#72

Post by majkinetor »

gilleain wrote: post #55
majkinetor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. I experimented 5+ years with it and took on several occasions 100+g per day with regular input between 10-15g per day. The only problem I had after 5 years is slight pain in esophagus immediately after taking C, but it passed after I switched to taking C on full stomach. Note: you MUST use pure AA powder, nothing else. Timing of C is essential - you must do it right, or the effects are minimal (you basica…

> Vitamin C is the most effective virus killer in large doses if you time it right. Which viruses? All viruses? With what mechanism? This is nothing more than molecular fanboyism. Nothing is a panacea.

Yes, almost all viruses. It boosts immune system which then takes care of the rest.

It works 4 some bacteria too , like h. Pylori. 5g pd eliminated infection in 1 study in 30% of patients which is really good result.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#73

Post by majkinetor »

scott_s wrote: post #60
majkinetor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. I experimented 5+ years with it and took on several occasions 100+g per day with regular input between 10-15g per day. The only problem I had after 5 years is slight pain in esophagus immediately after taking C, but it passed after I switched to taking C on full stomach. Note: you MUST use pure AA powder, nothing else. Timing of C is essential - you must do it right, or the effects are minimal (you basica…

Ironically, you're talking about the very thing this article leads with: that Linus Pauling touted vitamin C as a miracle cure with over-dosing, despite no evidence, and none has been found. (I also think that article lead is irresponsible, because if it turns out this study holds up, and vitamin C is a viable treatment for this kind of cancer, we have soundly shown it does not work in the many areas we have tested i…

No , we have proof that small insignificant doses do not work. Nobody ever said otherwise.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#74

Post by majkinetor »

mrfusion wrote: post #52
majkinetor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. I experimented 5+ years with it and took on several occasions 100+g per day with regular input between 10-15g per day. The only problem I had after 5 years is slight pain in esophagus immediately after taking C, but it passed after I switched to taking C on full stomach. Note: you MUST use pure AA powder, nothing else. Timing of C is essential - you must do it right, or the effects are minimal (you basica…

What would help gum disease?

Vit c, fish oil, coenzime q10, mumio, low carb. All for the best effect.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#75

Post by majkinetor »

muaddirac wrote: post #58
majkinetor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not at all. I experimented 5+ years with it and took on several occasions 100+g per day with regular input between 10-15g per day. The only problem I had after 5 years is slight pain in esophagus immediately after taking C, but it passed after I switched to taking C on full stomach. Note: you MUST use pure AA powder, nothing else. Timing of C is essential - you must do it right, or the effects are minimal (you basica…

I would recommend listening to this sometime: http://www.maximumfun.org/sawbones/sawbones-vitamins I'd be curious to see if you still hold the same opinions. (It's a very entertaining podcast too!)

Dude....

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#76

Post by majkinetor »

bitL wrote: post #57
majkinetor wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vitamin C doesn't cure common cold, but it sure as hell a) shortens it b) prevents complications (which may rise to be chronic). What vitamin C does is prevent common cold, if taken the right way. Pauling cure for common cold was never really tested. All papers on common cold used very small doses, almost all bellow 1g. Paulling advocated 1-2g every hour. I tried it and it works for me, but timing is crucial - it mus…

Did you try taking zinc right after an onset of symptoms? I experimented with that one and had like 50% probability of getting over some common viroses within one day.

Yes i did. Alone it isnt that effective as C. Cobination is the best. Must be megadoze zinc too - 50 to 100 mg.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#77

Post by scott_s »

majkinetor wrote: post #73
scott_s wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, you're talking about the very thing this article leads with: that Linus Pauling touted vitamin C as a miracle cure with over-dosing, despite no evidence, and none has been found. (I also think that article lead is irresponsible, because if it turns out this study holds up, and vitamin C is a viable treatment for this kind of cancer, we have soundly shown it does not work in the many areas we have tested i…

No , we have proof that small insignificant doses do not work. Nobody ever said otherwise.

What do you deem "insignificant"? The required daily dose is about 90 mg. There are experiments which include several grams [1, 2, 3], which is a large enough dose that those writing the papers call it a "megadose". If you consider a megadose to be 1,000g and 10,000g, then I think that's just moving the goal posts. Is there a dosage level at which you would say, "Yes, with no clear signal at that level, it's probable it makes no difference"?

[1] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11700812?dopt=Abstract

[2] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23440782

[3] http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8191227, shows some positive evidence, which may be noise, and concludes "needs more research" - despite there already being a lot, with no clear positive signal.

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#78

Post by gabemart »

majkinetor wrote: post #69
gabemart wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> vitamin C has no side effects I'm not aware of evidence that this is true for megadoses (e.g. 10g per day, as you mentioned). Given that you are making a claim not supported by mainstream medical consensus (that megadoses of vitamin C have positive health effects), you are essentially arguing that megadoses of Vitamin C have a different effect than regular doses. Given that you admit that megadoses have a different…

Yes , metabolism of vit C changes during desease which is easily checked on your own with bowel tollerance method. The claim it is not supported by mainstream medicine is nonsence. Like I said its not investigated. Only small doses are.

How could it possibly be supported if you admit it has not been investigated?

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#79

Post by scott_s »

majkinetor wrote: post #67
scott_s wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Research on vitamin C does not agree with your conclusions.

You should inform yourself more and read papers on your own.

Everything I have read either concludes "no measurable benefit" or "statistically significant, but not clinically significant benefit; need more research". That latter is hard to distinguish from noise. What have you found that concludes otherwise?

Re: Vitamin C kills tumor cells with hard-to-treat mutation in mice

#80

Post by majkinetor »

scott_s wrote: post #79
majkinetor wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should inform yourself more and read papers on your own.

Everything I have read either concludes "no measurable benefit" or "statistically significant, but not clinically significant benefit; need more research". That latter is hard to distinguish from noise. What have you found that concludes otherwise?

Irrespective of the common cold, vitamin C is uniquely beneficial in many different scenarios. Negative paper on vitamin C is almost non existent.

Speaking about the vitamin C and common cold, since you don't have any good papers in mainstream medicine that tested Pauling protocol you must turn to those groups that did so and use it in every day practice - orthomolecular practitioners. I am sure you will recognize this is considered frindge science by mainstream medicine but that is irrelevant since they didn't do the job. The situation is similar to that of vitamin C and cancer. Original claims by Pauling were not tested and instead we got Moertel studies on Mayo clinic that concluded that Pauling protocol does not good, except that they didn't test it at all. Check out the history here, highly informative paper:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2981594/

Most of the experiments were done by Dr. Cathcart who treated over 20000 patients using vitamin C and extensively documented it. Book "Ascorbate, the science of vitamin C" by Hickey is also very informative.

But don't limit yourself to common cold, just look everything that vitamin C does in the body, and I am sure you will change your opinion.

The fact is, AA is the main anti-stress molecule for the animal body (thats why they didn't delegate production to plants and still produce high quantity of AA from glucose on daily basis), just as GSH is primary endogenous antioxidant and detoxication agent.

Humans did have some adaptation to GULO loss for sure, but modern lifestyle sure as hell topped that in other direction.

The major problem is dosing as half life of vitamin C is very low and you have to make the dose right in order to neutralize it or effects are not impressive. See this graph by Cathart:

http://www.doctoryourself.com/images/titr.gif

which says that symptoms start to disappear only when you are very close to bowel tolerance. Notice the dose also - 1g per day is non existent compared to ~100g per day that Cathart used. I tried that many times, and it works for me. It is especially true for alcohol intoxication where the same protocol will bring you back from nonoperational to fully normal person in few hours.

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