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Tesla ending Models S and X production

cnbc.com

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Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#661

Post by mekdoonggi »

poulpy123 wrote: post #600
cucumber3732842 wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cybertruck was very clearly designed to be a low production model to figure out teething issues in manufacturing and design. Think Plymouth Prowler. Like seriously, nobody makes a body out of heavy gauge sheet metal with simple shapes if they're planning on volume, it doesn't pencil out vs more die complexity and thinner material. But the future growth to justify that never seems to have materialized....

Elon Musk said he estimated 250k to 500k yearly sales

So he's off by, what Elon might say is an "order of magnitude"

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#663

Post by darkwater »

martin_a wrote: post #629
lnsru wrote: post #540

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are people like me who still buy teslas. Buddy picked up his new Model Y couple weeks ago. The price and the whole package is fine. Zero interest financing is absolutely nice. Elon showed his real face during children rescue drama in Asia. With this defamation story it was well known who he is for years. Political involvement was the visible tip of an iceberg for everyone. Now if you ask me if the German car ma…

> Overall German equivalent of model Y is at least 20000€ more expensive than Elon‘s car. What?!? VW id.4 has the same starting price as a Tesla Model Y if I look it up on their German websites. Don't see where the swasticar would be cheaper.

Starting price is the same with less equipment. If you start putting the same things the new "cheap" Model Y has already by default, ID4 goes ~5k more expensive (and with less WLTP and I didn't check the charging curve)

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#664

Post by dizhn »

yorwba wrote: post #468
dizhn wrote: post #405

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> BYD is eating Tesla for lunch For some reason my Youtube echo chamber is trying to convince me that BYD makes so many cars but cannot sell them. It's really bizarre. Other things it's trying to convince me of "Don't get an electric car. Period", "Ukraine won. Done deal", "Trump is devastated" about something else every day. Yes I do want the latter two to be true and it's playing on that but I don't get the BYD thi…

BYD is selling a lot of cars, but they're also making a lot more cars than they can sell at sticker price in China, as does every other Chinese car company. This oversupply leads to all kinds of distortions, like dealerships registering cars as "sold" to make their sales targets and then selling those brand-new cars as "used" at a discount. https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/local-... Maybe your Yo…

Right. I can imagine seeing lots full of unsold cars might be interpreted as "there is no demand", especially if they are trying to push a particular narrative.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#665

Post by eldaisfish »

krzyk wrote: post #547
arethuza wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would a small Tesla "eat Chinese for lunch" - the brand is tainted (to put it mildly) and the Teslas I've been in didn't seem to have great design or build quality?

> Teslas I've been in didn't seem to have great design or build quality Design is subjective (I like it), and build quality. Not sure, I don't have issues with mine except one where after 2 years frunk latch started failing. It was replaced in an hour when I went to service center. Teslas are the cheapest EV for the features offered in Europe. I would gladly buy another car, but they are either more pricey, or lack f…

not having door handles in an obvious location is such a subjective "feature" that people have been killed in fires because of the door handle placement.

I've lost count of the number of times i've seen tesla drivers "defrosting" their door handles. You may live in a sunny desert but many people do not.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#666

Post by readmodifywrite »

disillusioned wrote: post #313
jcgrillo wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We "just" need to figure out the terraforming problem then we can all move to Mars and be interplanetary explorers. Imagine how cool it would be to have corporate leaders who had vision--environmentally friendly automobiles, cheap space travel, etc.--without the clammy snake oil grifter bullshit. Reality is cool AF . The things that are actually achievable are amazing. We don't need to spout nonsense to do great thin…

The Mars obsession absolutely blows me away. Like, he's obviously read KSR's Red Mars. He's obviously aware of the conditions out there. Mars is a fuckin' bummer . It is absolutely hostile to human life. Sure, we'll land people there, and maybe set up some sort of station if we really want to throw a few trillion dollars away from actual problems here on earth... but it's not going to be pleasant. Not anytime, ever.…

The guy owns a rocket company and still hasn't even been to LEO. Katy Perry has spent more time in space than Elon.

Mars isn't happening, at least not on his watch.

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#667

Post by torginus »

SecretDreams wrote: post #569
torginus wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an opinion on EVs that basically the only models that make sense are the ones shaped like the 3 and Y. I feel like EVs are a checkbox product - you either make things 'good enough' for the customer - range, driving dynamics, power, charge speed, smart features, autonomous stuff or don't. To get range right you need a big battery and low drag and efficiency - the only way you can make the first 2 things in the…

> This is not only my opinion but the market's - S and X sold like 2 orders of magnitude less cars than the 3 and Y. They sold less because they're far more expensive and have to compete against much more well put together products. Meanwhile, their platforms are 10 years old and there are now other offerings in an overall niche field. You're right about aero to an extent, but aero is only felt on long highway drives…

I think range only really matters in the context of highway drives, I kinda dislike these composite estimates like WLTP (as you can never be sure of what exactly they measure)

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#669

Post by vel0city »

rossjudson wrote: post #193
sixQuarks wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I love FSD and I know it well. I probably wouldn't feel super comfortable in a Tesla taxi. I've seen too much.

Tesla doesn't even trust their own full self driving system. They still have safety monitors for their self-driving taxi service.

The Las Vegas Loop continues to have actual drivers and that's an enclosed space entirely controlled by Tesla. If you can't even trust it in a single lane space you completely control, how can you trust it in the real world?

Re: Tesla ending Models S and X production

#670

Post by sejje »

mrexcess wrote: post #646
ACCount37 wrote: post #587

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This LIDAR wank annoys me. If you can train a policy that drives well on cameras, you can get self-driving. If you can't, you're fucked, and no amount of extra sensors will save you. Self-driving isn't a sensor problem. It always was, is, and always will be an AI problem. No amount of LIDAR engineering will ever get you a LIDAR that outputs ground truth steering commands. The best you'll ever get is noisy depth estim…

>Self-driving isn't a sensor problem. It always was, is, and always will be an AI problem. AI + cameras have relevant limitations that LIDAR augmented suites don't. You can paint a photorealistic roadway onto a brick wall and AI + cameras will try to drive right through it, dubbed the "Wile E. Coyote" problem.

Will humans?
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