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On anti-crypto toxicity

blog.mollywhite.net

641–650 of 734 posts

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#641

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Err… can you explain in more detail how social security works in Poland, and how it is pyramidal, or at least multi-level?

Well, all redistributive social security systems have a strong pyramid like scheme inherent to them. Take the German retirement funds which - AFAIK — works similarly to „social security“ in the US: Every employee in Germany is required to pay a share of about 20% of their income (1) into the retirement „fund“ — which isn’t one really as the money is not invested to gain interest but instead is immediately payed out t…

OK, so redistributive pension systems are pyramid schemes… I’ll just note that this is a highly debatable interpretation of such systems.

Now if we think about it for a moment: social security need money for 3 major things: unemployment, retirement, and health care. At any given point in time, you can divide the population in 2 categories: those who are currently working, and those who are not. And those who are currently working pay those who are not (gross oversimplification). The question is whether the workers pay enough money to sustain the idle.

Now health care and unemployment ought to be fairly constant (barring some major crisis), and you can have rules so people don’t abuse the system too much. So no pyramid there: we adjust how much workers pay for health and unemployment and that’s the end of it.

Retirement however is subject to longer term variation because of that age pyramid. And at a time where we have boomers retiring, we have less working people to sustain them all. And it’s made quite worse when the salaries of the working people don’t even keep up with inflation. We could have solved this by having an exponentially growing population, but that is bound to crash at one point.

So okay, I understand the pyramid analogy there. There’s a problem though: the boomers will die. Population will eventually get over that hump, and we’ll have a more reasonable proportion of working & retired people again. So the temporary deficit is just that: temporary.

And if that’s not enough, there’s something simple we can do to solve the problem. It’s so obvious that (at least in France) people don’t even dare utter it on national television: just raise contributions a little bit.

But no, doing this is so unthinkable that our rulers would rather have people retire later. Which won’t work, because of structural unemployment. So what we’ll have instead is lower pensions, and an increased reliance on pension funds.

There’s a snag however: pension funds are actually a form of redistributive system. Because redistributive systems are the only system there can ever be. See, even though you’re ostensibly investing money so you can retire later, what happens in practice is that your money is being injected in parts of the economy to fuel your investment. And ultimately, part of that money will be used to pay currently retired people. And when you retire, and the time comes to get your money back, you won’t get your money from a frozen value store. You’ll get it from the current economy, be it interest rates from your investments or currently paying people. However you cut it, your pension has to be taken from the current economy, and the only way you get paid is if your pension fund (and by extension the whole economy), can support it.

I’d rather have an explicitly redistributive system, it’s more honest that way.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#642

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm grumpy about Visa/MC taking 3% of every transaction They don't. Scheme fees in a 4-party payment network are the smallest part of the net fee, around 0.1-0.2%. > I want a technofix for that. And you'll never get one. Moving money between bank accounts in an immutable way is extremely cheap already. But that isn't what people want. If you want to lower card payment fees you need to introduce regulations that cap…

> Moving money between bank accounts in an immutable way is extremely cheap already. Only true in certain countries, between certain banks/processors, and within certain thresholds. My last last transaction fee on Tezos was a fixed cost of 0.000544 xtz ($0.00177 USD), had no threshold limitations, required zero privacy invasion, settled in ~30 seconds, and was not limited to a particular bank or regional currency. Th…

And they won't, because once again, regulatory problems don't have technological solutions.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#643
post #57

What level of economic activity in crypto is unrelated to speculative gain. If you want to stop angry responses to claims for the value to economic process you need to be honest about the extent to which crypto is a game for massive speculative gain, pump and dump, washing and money laundering. Use of public signed ledger to audit value flow and provide certainty to low doc activity like cash in Africa, payments to f…

Is speculation unacceptable?

A smaller amount of speculation is informing of belief on future value. When it dominates, it tends to be gambling, ponzi, or both, as in ponzi to enrich a few, fuelled by gambling by many.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#644

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a related information nugget, HashCash that popularised proof-of-work concept before Bitcoin, was originally designed a email spam prevention tool. Goes far back as 1997. http://www.hashcash.org/

Maybe in some scifi future where energy is cheap and clean, we could use PoW for all kinds of things where PoS doesn't make sense.

What you are doing with Proof of Work is demonstrating that you are spending a relative amount of money to accomplish something by demonstrating some energy usage. As energy gets cheaper you would have to do more of it to keep up.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#645

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> usually comes from relatively wealthy people in stable countries whose idea about "poor people" comes from watching a Netflix overproduced dramatic documentary. Ok, I was born in Brazil and I experienced 40% per month inflation in the 80s and I saw a government confiscating everyone's saving accounts as part of a "economic plan". I also saw another government putting a tax of 0.38% on every financial transfer (does…

> government putting a tax of 0.38% on every financial transfer (does not seem like much until you think of all the cascading effects) Unlike crypto/web3 which checks notes puts a tax on everything > If you are talking about Bitcoin (or crypto currencies in general given how BTC unfortunately still makes its own gravity in the crypto market), I will 100% agree with you. Bitcoin's price fluctuation in the past year is…

What "tax" is put on web3? This is the kind of thing that seriously makes me doubt your interest in any reasonable debate.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, that's not creating energy.

Is buying solar panels and using them creating energy? If so you could do the same thing with your mining proceeds.

By that logic, anything that makes money makes energy. Because money is fungible. I could use money from any source to buy solar panels and use them to create energy.

I could use money I earned from selling power generated by a coal plant to buy solar panels. That doesn't make the coal plant produce twice the energy.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Underlying all of our financial transactions is debt. Even an ACH transfer is a very temporary debt in a network of trust. That's why people with "bad credit" can't get accounts at traditional banks. This hurdle does not exist in crypto. I'm not suggesting crypto is some panacea, but it does eliminate this very important problem for people on the bottom of the economic ladder.

There are very few people who do not use a bank account but still use cryptocurrency. This fantasy of banking the unbanked has remained a fantasy. In fact it is so impractical that barely anyone is working on it. Meanwhile technologies like UPI have actually transformed people's lives and actually made banking accessible to millions. Why focus on a dead end technology like crypto when we already have better options?

Is that system impervious to being shut down by a corrupt government like we saw Canada do recently when it locked the accounts of its own citizens?

Why focus on dead end legacy currency controlled by corrupt governments when you can adopt more modern modes of transacting?

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Moving money between bank accounts in an immutable way is extremely cheap already. Only true in certain countries, between certain banks/processors, and within certain thresholds. My last last transaction fee on Tezos was a fixed cost of 0.000544 xtz ($0.00177 USD), had no threshold limitations, required zero privacy invasion, settled in ~30 seconds, and was not limited to a particular bank or regional currency. Th…

And they won't, because once again, regulatory problems don't have technological solutions.

The achievements I listed cannot only be solved with regulation.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#649
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It turns out there are actually things that lawmakers don't really have the power to effectively ban, drugs and prostitution and gambling and cash transactions principally among them. A lot of people don't seem to integrate this fact. The practical power of a lawmaking body is not unlimited. There are certain things they simply cannot stop, no matter how many laws are passed. It won't "end" for either group, really.…

Theres one big weakness in the use of cryptocurrencies: swapping back and forth with the local fiat currency at scale. All a government has to do is shut those commercial ventures down, and the value of the $coin will disappear for those residents. Plus, unlike drugs and prostitution, the ledger is public and permanent… simplifying enforcement against the remaining fringes dramatically.

If they shut down, they will just push even more of their economy to the black markets.

Also, anonymity is not yet something that people care enough. But it already exists - monero, zcash, or the Aztec Network on top of Ethereum. I can bet that any serious attempt from the government at chasing regular people based on their Blockchain activity would lead to a lot to adopt the "truly private" networks.

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