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Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

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Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#641

Post by paulryanrogers »

unishark wrote: post #626
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

APIs are great.. i want an app to be able to list all the apps installed. I just don't want facebook app to do it, because it really doesn't need that data, and I don't want to give it to them. This should be done the same as with location and microphone access... ie. "ask the user". "Flashlight 2000 DX app wants to access list of apps installed - allow once, allow always, deny now, deny always". Facebook wants to tr…

I don't think they're great, it seems like a way of obfuscating what the app really does. Your approach might work for savvy or paranoid users, but not everyone notices much beyond "contains ads" or such. Apple needs to force them to be up front from the very beginning that their stupid game or screensaver or else is also a tracking app. And boot any app that uses your phone to do anything beyond what they told you t…

Didn't Apple have an ad mocking all the access prompts in Windows Vista?

My how things have changed

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#642

Post by DevKoala »

firephreek wrote: post #553

"Personalized Ads for Small Businesses" What a bunch of malarkey. I've worked in ad space and the actual ability for SB's to compete is laughable. Their budgets are so comparatively small that they simply don't get the assistance necessary. They're drinking through paper straws while the big dogs swim in lakes. SB's absolutely need a platform to compete, but I'm absolutely incredulous that FB is that platform, much l…

My GF built a small business with $12K MRR on top of Facebook and uses Facebook/Instagram ads. Apparently there are swarms of businesses like hers; buying and selling crystals.

I am against Facebook, but they are not lying at all. Facebook’s walled garden offers a robust advertising platform for small businesses that actually evens the field.

I do programmatic advertising on top of the open web, and your experience is correct there, but FB is different.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#643

Post by zepto »

ASalazarMX wrote: post #573
move-on-by wrote: post #44

I don't have Facebook and I'm generally skeptical of Apple's pro-privacy messaging. However, seeing this response from Facebook has gotten me very excited for this update. There must be more to it then Apple's generic 'Most Advanced Update Ever' marketing. I'm still skeptical of Apple's commitment to privacy, but I'm certainly happy to get this update. Apple should thank Facebook for the free marketing.

> I'm generally skeptical of Apple's pro-privacy messaging That's a very healthy attitude towards Apple's claims. They developed all these APIs that allow app makers to spy on their users, and then blame the app makers for spying. For example, why does any app need to know which other apps I have installed, and how long I use them? This permission should very sparingly pass the review process, and only for apps in sp…

> They developed all these APIs that allow app makers to spy on their users

What are you talking about?

They didn’t develop any such APIs, and have been progressively closing up anything that can be exploited that was left over from Mac OS.

Also, they aren’t blaming anyone for using anything they have built.

They are just asking users to consent to apps using it.

Why is that a problem?

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#644

Post by Geee »

I don't really get this tracking thing. It seems like they should be able to use some kind of super AI to predict what I'm most likely to buy next, and that would actually be useful for me. Sounds great but I never or very rarely see ads that even remotely match my preferences.

Also, I think markets have changed so that those companies who have great products don't need to advertise at all. Those companies who have the worst products will spend most on advertising. So, when I see an ad for an product, I know that it's likely to be a bad product.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#645

Post by Nextgrid »

mektrik wrote: post #608
nicoburns wrote: post #571

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does Apple's ad business track users though? It seems to me that an ad business shouldn't need to in order to be effective.

It does - it provides advertisers data on which users have downloaded their app after seeing specific adverts.

This is honestly pretty reasonable. Apple already knows which apps I download and this is made fairly clear (you're logged into the App Store and your account lists all apps you obtained).

Apple also knows which App Store ads I saw given that their server sent them to me in the first place. The ads are (at least for now) limited to the App Store and don't carry over across the web or other Apple apps.

Thus I don't see the problem with Apple using the data they've already got to provide anonymized conversion metrics to app developers.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#646

Post by Nextgrid »

katbyte wrote: post #630
kml wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's one giant fighting another. Apple wants to destroy ad revenue and shift everyone to a paid App model because Apple can get its 30%. I bet you if Apple loses control of the AppStore for anti trust reasons, they would be all for ads.

Shift everyone to a paid what? There is no alternative to Facebook lol

The advertising-funded business model being unviable would pave the way for an alternative to appear.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#647

Post by [deleted] »

move-on-by wrote: post #44

I don't have Facebook and I'm generally skeptical of Apple's pro-privacy messaging. However, seeing this response from Facebook has gotten me very excited for this update. There must be more to it then Apple's generic 'Most Advanced Update Ever' marketing. I'm still skeptical of Apple's commitment to privacy, but I'm certainly happy to get this update. Apple should thank Facebook for the free marketing.

[deleted]

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#649

Post by raheemm »

firephreek wrote: post #553

"Personalized Ads for Small Businesses" What a bunch of malarkey. I've worked in ad space and the actual ability for SB's to compete is laughable. Their budgets are so comparatively small that they simply don't get the assistance necessary. They're drinking through paper straws while the big dogs swim in lakes. SB's absolutely need a platform to compete, but I'm absolutely incredulous that FB is that platform, much l…

I know of a small business in upstate NY that gets 80% of their sales from FB ads. Without FB, this business which also has a retail store, would certainly be having a lot more of a rough time. And they are not an isolated story. I know of at least 5 other small businesses that similarly generate from 25% to 70% of sales via FB. It's given these small businesses a way to compete against bigger competitors.

Re: Facebook is pushing back on Apple’s new iPhone privacy rules

#650

Post by nuker »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #586
ASalazarMX wrote: post #573

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm generally skeptical of Apple's pro-privacy messaging That's a very healthy attitude towards Apple's claims. They developed all these APIs that allow app makers to spy on their users, and then blame the app makers for spying. For example, why does any app need to know which other apps I have installed, and how long I use them? This permission should very sparingly pass the review process, and only for apps in sp…

APIs are great.. i want an app to be able to list all the apps installed. I just don't want facebook app to do it, because it really doesn't need that data, and I don't want to give it to them. This should be done the same as with location and microphone access... ie. "ask the user". "Flashlight 2000 DX app wants to access list of apps installed - allow once, allow always, deny now, deny always". Facebook wants to tr…

> APIs are great.. i want an app to be able to list all the apps installed.

That a big No. List of apps uniquely identifies the device and the user. Is this api available??

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