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Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

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Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#631

Post by vcryan »

2001zhaozhao wrote: post #58

I suspect that this kind of tactic is going to be everywhere in a year or so. Entire fake personalities and organization websites on the Internet created just to push a narrative or to advertise a product, which completely drown out real information. At some point they may be indistinguishable from human-produced work, so the only way to verify if a site is someone's genuine opinion or AI-generated narrative is throu…

I wouldn't say everywhere. Who else is trying to cover up genocide, ethic cleansing, and apartheid?

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#632

Post by starik36 »

watutalkinbout wrote: post #374

They jumped the shark. You can't openly bomb a bunch of women and children into the dirt, on a daily basis for months and years, and smooth it over with some think tank articles. Might have worked 20 years ago, but not now.

If only there was a solution on the table that's been there for years and that one side refuses to accept over and over again. And that can put a stop to bombing or dirt or whatever.

Two state solution.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#633

Post by vcryan »

saidnooneever wrote: post #353
culi wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's already been happening for a very long time. The US' "Operation Earnest Voice" happened in 2010/2011[0] And it's not just state actors. Anyone who was online during the Amber Heard/Johnny Depp trials was likely inundated with media about that trial. Both of their legal teams utilized bots to drive online discussions[1][2] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Earnest_Voice [1] https://www.latimes.com/enter…

this has been happening since the dawn of information-communication systems basically. because ever since, people have had the ability to listen in, copy, learn from etc. - so there's always been incentive to spread disinformation for some parties. brand defence, nation-state influence operations. There are many different flavors of the same thing, trying to mislead competitors or enemies. Or to dupe consumers ofc...…

Yes, but when your trying to cover up a genocide it's a bit different

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#634

Post by somenameforme »

wiseowise wrote: post #322
N_Lens wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference between American and Russian propaganda is that Russians know it's propaganda.

This was a great, old anecdote. Until they’ve started the biggest European war of the century.

The scale of a war is more often decided by who decides to unexpectedly jump in moreso than the initial party. WW1 starts when a Bosnian Serb assassinates an Austro-Hungarian royal leading to Austria-Hungary invading Serbia. The the next thing you know Brits are killing Germans over it.

There are endless border clashes. Even in very recent times we have Armenia-Azerbaijan, Afghanistan-Pakistan, Thailand-Cambodia, and many more. Wiki gives more than 60 in the 21st century [1], and we're just getting started! And if other parties had decided to get involved and start jamming up the escalation ladder, any of those could have easily turned into a much bigger war, instead of being just yet another relatively inconsequential border conflict.

Or imagine if another country (perhaps Russia or China) had decided to 'pull a US' when the US invaded any of the countless countries we've invaded over the years - Iraq, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, Venezuela, Yemen, and so on just in quite recent times. That could very well have led to WW3, but it didn't because they didn't.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_border_conflicts#21st_...

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#635

Post by lopsotronic »

enaaem wrote: post #379

Despite the efforts, I have seen an increase in anti-zionist sentiment on the internet. Most notable on the right from people like Tucker Carlson en Candace Owens. People are tired of fighting another Middle-Eastern war for Israel.

One genuinely poisonous aspect of Israeli policy is that the more Jews as a people are persecuted, the better Israel as a nation does: demographically, economically, and diplomatically[1].

It was true in the days of Avraham Stern, and it's true today. It creates some truly horrific perverse incentives.

[1] By dint of being the "victim", even if it's not Israel the nation being victimized. A disastrous category error that the nation of Israel exploits quite shamelessly.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#636

Post by consensus1 »

rbanffy wrote: post #513
culi wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's already been happening for a very long time. The US' "Operation Earnest Voice" happened in 2010/2011[0] And it's not just state actors. Anyone who was online during the Amber Heard/Johnny Depp trials was likely inundated with media about that trial. Both of their legal teams utilized bots to drive online discussions[1][2] [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Earnest_Voice [1] https://www.latimes.com/enter…

I think the big difference is that before the internet you'd need to be a Murdoch to be able to do something like this. A good PR firm could fool a number of news outlets into thinking something is legit, but it was a lot harder to convince a professional journalist than it is to convince the average Faux News watcher.

I used to believe that, but too many times I have been proven wrong. Remember when the "professional journalists" were screaming about a terrorist plot against the UN last year and it was just a garden variety SIM farm running fraud?

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#637

Post by starik36 »

pepperoni_pizza wrote: post #498
KingMob wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really depends on the country. E.g., Israel has enjoyed a lot of support from the US, both officially and in public opinion, until just the last couple years.

Very much. For example here in Eastern Europe when people hear "Israeli" they tend to assume it means "Russian with Israeli passport, probably here to avoid sanctions or outbid locals on real estate". I'm sure it's very different in Turkey or say Thailand where they have Israel-born Israeli tourists, and surely different in US (though I have no idea what it is).

I am from Eastern Europe and people here "assumed" a lot of things about Jews way before Israel was even a thing. Let's not pretend Eastern Europeans would have loved Jews if it weren't for "Israel".

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#638

Post by vcryan »

starik36 wrote: post #632
watutalkinbout wrote: post #374

They jumped the shark. You can't openly bomb a bunch of women and children into the dirt, on a daily basis for months and years, and smooth it over with some think tank articles. Might have worked 20 years ago, but not now.

If only there was a solution on the table that's been there for years and that one side refuses to accept over and over again. And that can put a stop to bombing or dirt or whatever. Two state solution.

Or a one state solution with a Palestinian leader.

Re: Israel creates fake think tank in likely attempt to dupe AI chatbots

#640

Post by hazrmard »

aleph-z wrote: post #541

Are LLMs easy to "dupe"? E.g. by placing provably wrong "information" somewhere on the internet? If so what countermeasures can help?

I read this paper (https://arxiv.org/pdf/2410.13722) on pre-training poisoning of LLMs. The authors demonstrated that poisoning 0.1% of the pretraining dataset can measurably manipulate beliefs of the model.

What I read about is a more sophisticated supply chain attack. But these days, search previews use retrieval-augmented generation to parse websites to generate answers on the fly. In that case you don't need to poison the supply chain; good SEO is enough.

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