Why can't I write code inside my browser? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why can't I write code inside my browser?

#621

Post by Scea91 » Mon, Jan 18, 2021, 11:51 AM UTC

aspyct wrote: post #69

cryptica wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a variant of the no-code mindset where people expect coding to be easy. What they don't understand is that tools which aim to make coding easy or automatic don't add any value if the person using the tool doesn't understand all the nuances in the underlying logic which is being produced. Fully understanding the distinction between client and server is one such nuance. When it comes to coding, the bottleneck i…

> I don't think I've ever met anyone who was naturally good at thinking logically I've heard, though, that declarative programming (prolog, haskell etc) was a LOT easier for people who aren't trained in imperative programming. Whereas those who are actually have a hard time picking it up... As was my experience. @op have a look for declarative programming. You might like prolog :)

Doubt it. To do anything beyond basic stuff in Prolog you need to understand its resolution algorithm. And it is not enough to understand 'what' it does but also the 'how' which is basically a backtracking algorithm.

Re: Why can't I write code inside my browser?

#622

Post by bccdee » Tue, Jan 19, 2021, 5:31 PM UTC

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #457

bccdee wrote: post #447

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue that Rust is meaningfully simpler than C++. Mind you, it's also a fairly feature-rich language, but the complexity of C++ comes from decades of new features building up trying to supersede older features. C++ is several different languages by now depending on which feature set you use, but Rust is still just one language. C++'s complexity is also a product of design choices like using templates to do both g…

I don't know much about Rust, because it doesn't seem to be the kind of language I want to use, so I can't personally speak to its complexity. However, I do know that a lot of objections to it from the people I follow are around the borrow checker and both the friction and high[0] compile times it causes. [0] to put that in context, Jon is frequently annoyed by the sub-second linking time incurred by LLVM because it…

The borrow-checker is a big source of frustration for beginners, because it forces you to write code differently, so it takes a lot of getting used to. But I don't think I would characterize it as a source of complexity in the language. Frankly, once you get used to it, it makes the language simpler, because it means you don't need to worry about shared mutability. The complexity that does exist tends to come from the zero-cost no-copy abstractions which rust is so fond of, or `unsafe`, which exposes you to a whole world of complexity which safe rust protects you from.

Re: Why can't I write code inside my browser?

#623

Post by aspaceman » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 2:12 AM UTC

colejohnson66 wrote: post #53

shatteredspace wrote: post #8

I take the "wtf is user/local/bin in $path?" to be a question from a non-tech person that is interested in learning to code. I can't be sure though since the author stated he has failed to install Node js. Should Chrome have Node JS loaded into it during install? I don't do web-dev so my answer is no. Should there be browsers made for those learning web-dev that come with these? By all means, sure. Go nuts. This also…

My question is: why can’t the Node installer add /usr/local/bin to the path itself (if needed)? Why force me to do it? The Windows installer did it for me. I can just type `node` or `deno` into PowerShell and it loads up a REPL. I never had to add them to `PATH`.

It expects /usr/local/bin/ to be on the $PATH, and so it adds itself to that location.

It doesn't know if you purposely meant to remove it's install location from the PATH, so it doesn't re-add it.

It could do what you ask, but this requires setting the $PATH. The most common way to do so is modifying bashrc, but now you're modifying the user's bashrc. Now you ask, is the user using bash? Maybe you're using the fancy whiz-bang ohmyzsh since that's what Medium told you to do, and now that doesn't work either.

If you keep /usr/local/bin on your $PATH (which is standard in most 'nix installations) then you don't have to change anything or do anything. Why do _you_ have such an abnormal system? We can play this game all day and it's fucking miserable. Just learn how to use your tools for fuck's sake.

Re: Why can't I write code inside my browser?

#624

Post by robertlagrant » Wed, Jan 20, 2021, 3:52 PM UTC

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #545

kaoD wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was there in the past and the tools are really not comparable. I just inserted a floppy disk and did A: then TP.EXE (which was just as arcane as knowing $PATH) but do I really want to work on Turbo Pascal in MS-DOS? Of course complexity skyrocketed! That's not a counterexample because beginners have contemporary expectations. There are simpler alternatives that just work. Why do beginners want to use Node.js locall…

> I was there in the past and the tools are really not comparable. I just inserted a floppy disk and did D: then TP.EXE but do I really want to work on Turbo Pascal in MS-DOS? Of course complexity skyrocketed! Did it do so for reasons that are still relevant today, is the question. > That's not a counterexample because beginners have contemporary expectations. Alright I'll present a counterexample: Lazarus. You downl…

You seem to be advocating for an IDE-style environment, examples of which abound. Is that all this whole discussion is about?