Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever • Hacker News Board

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#621

Post by kabacha » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:45 PM UTC

dddbbb wrote: post #137

I work at a large tech company on a young team (average age is late twenties). In my experience many don't view working from home regularly as a benefit. I understand that must change drastically when you're middle aged, have a family to live around and a spacious house in the suburbs. But most younger people want to live in the middle of the city (i.e. small, often shared apartments but a short commute) and have no…

I feel the opposite. It's hard to focus on work with family at home. If your young and single then remote work is a perfect fit.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#622

Post by intended » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:46 PM UTC

allenu wrote: post #190

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but it would also be good if more (tech) companies offered a decent working environment. That's coming from personal experience btw, where most jobs / assignments I've had, it was usually open plan, flexible seat arrangements. I have a new job now where I have a fixed desk with a set of drawers. It's a breath of fresh air and honestly it sounds so stupid and trivial. But employers don't have their employees' b…

My even more cynical take is that companies are finding employees are way more productive working from home. I think part of it could be that with COVID-19, a lot of us are looking for an outlet for our energies, and so are working harder than normal.

The evidence is not in favor of long term WFH though.

The evidence shows that WFH work creep is a thing - you get people who dont know how to turn off, and bosses who think they can get more out of you since you are a few feet away from your laptop.

There is also a decrease in creativity and networking - evidence again shows that a good team has someone who is very tuned to the emotional and mental states of the people around them doing a lot of bridging.

Finally - the people who work at office get more money over time, unless the firm takes active measures to combat these biases.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#623

Post by fasteddie31003 » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:48 PM UTC

Can I move from CA to Reno NV, work remote, and pay no state income tax in NV?

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#624

Post by intended » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:52 PM UTC

ilaksh wrote: post #421

enjo wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an executive (Product and Technology specifically) at a mostly work from home company: I find that engineers can do a pretty good job of effectively collaborating thanks to PR's, Slack, JIRA, and a host of other asynchronous tools. It's on the product side that things are tougher. Great product work is often about finding meaningful insights in the data available to you, and that often involves long conversations…

It sounds like the product people are sitting in long meetings. Have you considered the idea that people were already disengaged in those meetings, they were just putting up a better front because they could tell everyone was watching them closely in person? And now that they are at home, they are not trying as hard to pretend they are listening closely, and since they are more comfortable, they are staying in the me…

He is correct - the evidence overlaps with his experience.

Creativity is better face to face.

WFH works perfectly for routine non random event related work.

When you need to communicate fast, need to come up with insights - essentially when you need that high bandwidth node to node interaction of working together - then face to face is significantly superior.

We are designed to work with other humans - chunks of grey matter exist only to interpret non verbal cues. Heck we actually suck at symbol manipulation and math, those are learned skills we force our species to pick up.

It should not be surprising that when working face to face, we end up using those default programs installed in us to get more work done.

Just being able to clarify something is faster if done in person because you have access to body language, eye direction, and tone.

Video goes only so far, and is still not as immediate and in person as physical presence.

https://interactions.acm.org/archive/view/march-april-2014/h...

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/11/when-wo...

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#625

Post by hoveringcto » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:53 PM UTC

TacoToni wrote: post #213

sylens wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would love for more companies to embrace this just to open up the candidate pool for positions. There are so many positions at Microsoft, for example, that I would have loved to apply for, but they require you to be in Redmond, and I'm just not in a position to relocate.

Completely agree - I've tried and failed many times to move from Orlando to Bay area. FAANG (finance work) wasnt willing to pay to relocate so they always went with local candidates over me. There are little to no interesting companies in my area. I want to work and help build the future. I was willing to take a paycut from MCOL to HCOL area for jobs and willing to go down in seniority for a chance to work at a big c…

If you are willing to take a pay and level cut, why not just pay your relocation yourself? It's not expensive long term if you think you will do well and be rewarded at the new company.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#626

Post by Unbeliever69 » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:55 PM UTC

Ididntdothis wrote: post #9

It would be good if more tech companies embraced this. I bet if they need tools for themselves we’ll see a lot of progress in remote collaboration tools. To make this work I wonder how executives will adapt. In my company the higher you go up the chain, the more they want face to face communication. I guess most top executives are people persons so not seeing things like body language or using body language takes awa…

We are a small SAAS startup that is funded by a slightly larger architectural services firm. My partner was staunchly against WFH until he saw productivity rise and employee satisfaction go through the roof when the business was forced into WFH. While he will continue to come to the office (because he is an old dog), everyone else is WFH forever. He owns the building so i'm sure he'll attempt to rent out the vacated office space. When he realizes nobody is going to want his office space due to severe oversupply, I wouldn't be surprised if he sells the building or converts the land into something more profitable. You might ask, what changed? He assumed that people who work from home won't be effective. He lacked trust. The employees proved to be trustworthy.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#627

Post by dntbnmpls » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:58 PM UTC

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #55

Ididntdothis wrote: post #9

It would be good if more tech companies embraced this. I bet if they need tools for themselves we’ll see a lot of progress in remote collaboration tools. To make this work I wonder how executives will adapt. In my company the higher you go up the chain, the more they want face to face communication. I guess most top executives are people persons so not seeing things like body language or using body language takes awa…

Maybe, but it would also be good if more (tech) companies offered a decent working environment. That's coming from personal experience btw, where most jobs / assignments I've had, it was usually open plan, flexible seat arrangements. I have a new job now where I have a fixed desk with a set of drawers. It's a breath of fresh air and honestly it sounds so stupid and trivial. But employers don't have their employees' b…

> My cynical take on this move is that the company doesn't have to pay as much for office space + worker transport anymore.

Don't forget it removes the work/home barrier. Now you are at work 24/7 and on call at all hours. Work and productivity has consumed most of modern life. The last bastion of freedom from work/productivity was the home. Now people are celebrating the loss of that precious personal space. Strange.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#628

Post by vinniejames » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:58 PM UTC

nathan_long wrote: post #334

vinniejames wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Companies don't do this. They will adjust your salary down based on your city of residence. Square is one example of this. You're not compensated for the value you provide, you're compensated for the cost of living near the office. You're also now competing against a national talent pool vs locals only

So you're considering Candidate A, who lives in SF, and B, who lives in a small town. You decide that B has to compete with A on talent, but A doesn't have to compete with B on price. Does that make strategic sense?

Candidate A probably wouldn't live in SF if he didn't have to

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#629

Post by seanmcdirmid » Tue, May 12, 2020, 11:59 PM UTC

_nckn wrote: post #620

I think this is the hugest news yet. It suddenly opens the pool of candidates to all across the country. I expect other tech giants will follow suit. Those who previously can't afford or don't want to live in big cities like NYC/Seattle/SF because they are older, have families, or various other reasons now are included in the candidate pool. This can go two ways: either the local software business will have to compet…

That assumes they restrict remote work to America for work that was done previously in the states. If this picks up, and there are no legal restrictions on what country a remote employee must be in, then the low end might just go much lower than what it currently is in small cities.

Re: Twitter Will Allow Employees to Work at Home Forever

#630

Post by HighPlainsDrftr » Wed, May 13, 2020, 12:02 AM UTC

makapuf wrote: post #607

Ididntdothis wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be great and healthy for the whole country if things were more spread out.

Maybe even for the whole world. There surely is talent some places you dont expect, that cannot move to bay area but would love (and could do) a top it job and cannot move out. In ok countries, with few salary differences from USA, even.

I live in Wyoming. A few years ago, I was debating about trying to build up some decent 'tech spaces/small campuses' in some of the more remote/less populated and desirable area's.

Some of my thoughts were: - Make sure there is good high speed internet - Good conferencing - Good office / working conditions - Great outdoor activities nearby

For a flat rate per month, a person could have a furnished apartment, a working space nearby, and access to the great outdoors. If I had multiple locations, you could switch locations after a week or two.

Why wouldn't someone in the Bay area want to go live in Sheridan, wyo for a few weeks, then possibly Laramie, Wyo. Maybe some Zion in Utah for a bit. Royal Gorge in Colorado.

Every few weeks, you just pack up your laptop, clothes, bikes, and go to the next spot.

I guess its office/lifestyle timeshare space.

I never pursued it beyond thinking about it.