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Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

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Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#611

Post by jasode »

palata wrote: post #507
jasode wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Also Android has a bigger market share in the world than iOS, by a lot. The tone of that seems like you thought I was taking the discussion into fanboy evangelism and therefore Android needed to be defended. That wasn't the intent and I already tried to downplay my comment by stating the iOS ecosystem specifics do not matter to 99% of mainstream users. Yes, everybody on HN already knows Android has a much bigger mar…

Wow I don't get all the downvotes I'm getting for that. You answered to: >> I don't see any iOS advantage with the apps anymore. With a list of apps, some of which only listed because they got Android support a few months later. And some of which I have never heard of (SmartSDR?). I get why those apps matter to you , but it feels a bit arbitrary. While the quote refers to something that was more general (which sugges…

>I get why those apps matter to you, [...] I am just saying that the answer "no but I checked the app I like on iOS and a handful of them don't exist on Android" was kind of one anecdotal data point in the discussion.

No, you don't get why it matters to me. You assuming my comment was just a personal list of my favorite apps is way off base. To be clear, I have never installed nor used any of those apps on either iOS nor Android.

So if I don't have any personal connection to those apps, why do I have that list handy?!? Because I was researching possible coding strategies for a new smartphone app:

- have 2 separate native mobile codebases (Swift AND Kotlin) from the start and therefore can release at the same time on both Apple App Store and Google Play. Difficult and expensive. Finite time and funds means both native apps suffer from less features and polish.

- or start with deliberate handicap of just 1 native codebase (e.g. iOS-only for initial launch) and see if it can attract revenue/funding to pay for the other native codebase (e.g. then Android). Or do the reverse of Android-first-then-iOS. Focusing on just 1 native platform means the app is higher quality. However, the risk is a clone app could quickly show up on the other platform I didn't code for.

- or 1 cross-platform toolkit with something like React Native which is what Meta and Microsoft Office apps like Outlook did.

That was why and how that list was created. The purpose was to get enough industry examples to form a generalization of what others did. I often do software research and my notes let me make lists about it. (Another one of my comments listing software I don't personally use but I do know the monthly costs : https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42331312)

I thought the iOS apps list was a neutral comment full of factual information and also counterbalanced with the areas where Android has an enormous influence. Yet somehow, my comment is still interpreted as some type of smear on Android. If you're confused about downvotes, I am too!

If you go back to the gp's comment I replied to, he literally asked: >"What else is there, where is the advantage?"

This thread is full of people replying with examples of the "what else". How could any of us seriously answer that question without the answers being criticized as "arbitrary" ?

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#612

Post by jhatemyjob »

onli wrote: post #56
AlotOfReading wrote: post #12

Google's long term strategy with Android is baffling to me. Apple has had better mobile hardware for years. Apple has higher consumer trust. Apple has better app selection (for most people). Apple has been increasingly implementing the core features that differentiate Android devices, like USB-C and RCS. Every Android user lost to the increasing iOS market share is another customer Google has to pay exorbitant fees t…

I don't see any iOS advantage with the apps anymore. That was maybe true in the very beginning, during the gold rush time of the app store. But not since then. In which category are there better iOS apps? Browsers? No, strictly worse. Youtube app? No, worse. Texting? Worse or equal (Whatsapp). Podcast client? I assume worse, since there is no Antenna Pod. Social media apps? The iOS variants of those apps are afaik in…

I don't understand how, almost 20 years after the release of these platforms, there are fully grown adult mobile OS fanboys still out there that either consciously or unconsciously spread lies about the difference between the platforms. Not just the parent comment, but this entire comment tree. For both iOS and Android. It's an almost religious cult-like type of behavior that reminds me of teenagers back in the early 2010s engaging in flamewars in YouTube comments arguing in favor of whichever gaming console they happen to own.

In that context, it made sense because they were kids, but also, these platforms were new with not much information out there, and the users were basically forced to pick one platform or the other because of the diminishing returns from owning both. 15 years ago, a PS3 or an Xbox 360 cost around $500, which adjusted for inflation is around $800 today. Not worth dropping an extra $800 for a few exclusive titles.

In the context of Android and iOS, you can gain access to both of these platforms quite easily... I mean, presumably, you already own an Android or iOS device already. For $150 you can get a decent device on the used market. Not state-of-the-art, but pretty good, all things considered. And with that you can gain a holistic perspective.

I seriously just don't get how you can stay faithful to either Android or iOS. They both are awful. I sort of see it as a necessary evil, pick your poison sort of thing. But some people get Stockholm Syndrome and never bother to try the alternatives I guess? I find that really odd.

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#614

Post by econ »

atomicnumber3 wrote: post #597
gunalx wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The indie dev market is a flip flop, I have seen many great apps only available on android as well.

This is more because the barrier to entry is so much lower. Android: have laptop that can do virtualization (...so basically ever laptop that can also do this:) and have enough ram to do run Android studio. Then you theoretically also need an Android device but even that's just because I assume you want to use the app you're making. That's it. iOS: $100/yr entry fee, plus you need Apple hardware, plus a "server" mode…

The www wins. All you need is something that can run a browser. You edit a line, save, refresh and there it is, the real finished product, not emulation.

Apps have terrible reliability too. I just wanted to order a pizza, the restaurant website offered a button for the play store and app store.

There it said the app was for an outdated version of Android.

Perhaps it had been like that for a long time? But lets imagine it happened today. Where are you to get your orders from? Ahh yes, the website.

If apps didn't get the icon on the home screen 90% wouldn't have a reason to exist.

Bunch of pictures with descriptions and an add to cart button. One shouldn't even need to write code, it should be as simple and obvious as serving a document. In stead you need a full time carpenter to keep the store running. The counter and shelves spontaneously collapse, doors regularly get stuck, light fixtures rain down from the ceiling.

People trying to sell pizza deserve better, we can do better.

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#615

Post by krzyk »

AlotOfReading wrote: post #12

Google's long term strategy with Android is baffling to me. Apple has had better mobile hardware for years. Apple has higher consumer trust. Apple has better app selection (for most people). Apple has been increasingly implementing the core features that differentiate Android devices, like USB-C and RCS. Every Android user lost to the increasing iOS market share is another customer Google has to pay exorbitant fees t…

Apple has better app selection? Where? Does it have Tasker? Or browsers that aren't reskin of safari?

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#616

Post by krferriter »

bigstrat2003 wrote: post #522
8note wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how do you live without ublock on your browser though? firefox with adblock is the high quality youtube app

Brave on Android has ad blocking built in, I would assume it does in iOS too. No need for ublock in that case.

Correct. Brave on iOS is worse than Brave on Android because Apple forces it to be a Safari skin, but they're still able to achieve some UI improvements over Safari, and achieve their built-in adblocking.

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#617

Post by mrsssnake »

isodev wrote: post #146

So, which 3rd mobile vendor and/or OS are you moving to?

Would switch to PostmarketOS tomorrow if there was any fully supported hardware (camera, 4G calling, etc.). All programs/apps I use are FOSS and standardized anyway.

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#618

Post by JoshTriplett »

SoftTalker wrote: post #435
swiftcoder wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, as someone who is mainly a programmer, same. But high-end cameras, big touchscreens, and an excellent pencil input is sort of the optimal device for a whole bunch of creative tasks

Are the cameras "high-end"? Good for a phone, certainly. But compared to a real camera with a much bigger lens and sensor?

> Good for a phone, certainly.

The multiple lenses and the processing power make smartphones wildly better than almost any consumer camera, particularly for someone without professional photography skills. A professional camera in the hands of a professional photographer can do better, but that means the market has changed from "consumers buy consumer cameras, professionals buy professional cameras" to "consumers use the camera that's always in their pocket and get surprisingly good results, professionals buy professional cameras".

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#619

Post by swiftcoder »

bigyabai wrote: post #473
swiftcoder wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In which category are there better iOS apps? Almost all of the prosumer apps on iOS offer a consistently better experience. This is maybe less relevant on phones than on tablets, but music production, video editing, digital painting and drafting, etc...

The iOS prosumer apps are, frankly, pathetic. I produce music and every single DAW/plugin on iPad is very clearly a "lite" version of something that would run better on a full-featured OS. There's really no workflow I can imagine that doesn't entail using a real PC for basic mixing and arrangement.

> I produce music and every single DAW/plugin on iPad is very clearly a "lite" version of something...

I agree in several cases, but the question here wasn't "are they better than PC equivalents", it was "are they better than what's available on Android"

Re: Google confirms 'high-friction' sideloading flow is coming to Android

#620

Post by NoahZuniga »

onli wrote: post #56
AlotOfReading wrote: post #12

Google's long term strategy with Android is baffling to me. Apple has had better mobile hardware for years. Apple has higher consumer trust. Apple has better app selection (for most people). Apple has been increasingly implementing the core features that differentiate Android devices, like USB-C and RCS. Every Android user lost to the increasing iOS market share is another customer Google has to pay exorbitant fees t…

I don't see any iOS advantage with the apps anymore. That was maybe true in the very beginning, during the gold rush time of the app store. But not since then. In which category are there better iOS apps? Browsers? No, strictly worse. Youtube app? No, worse. Texting? Worse or equal (Whatsapp). Podcast client? I assume worse, since there is no Antenna Pod. Social media apps? The iOS variants of those apps are afaik in…

Just wanted to chime in to say Antenna Pod is really good.
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