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Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

bluewin.ch

611–620 of 655 posts

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#611
post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spiritual strength is the ability to be a smug jerk to others because you think you’re better than them. It certainly is a coping mechanism for some people, but it’s hardly one that should be encouraged.

I’ve been nothing but nice on this comment thread. If you disagree with me but can’t gather the words to explain yourself It’s no reason to call me a name for your lack of vocabulary or understanding.

If you think it's "nice" suggesting to people that their close family must not love them, and they must not adequately love the close family that they cared for, then I recommend you don't be "nice".

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#612
This is one reason why as I’ve entered my 50’s, I’ve decided to take every advantage of modern medicine including hormone management and performance enhancing drugs. I started three years ago at 47 and now I’m living my best life at 50, in the best physical condition that I’ve been in since my early twenties. Although I’d certainly like to live a lot more years, I care more about my quality of life than the quantity of years. If I make it to my 80’s, it’ll be with the testosterone of a man in his 20’s and muscle mass on my body.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always think of that scene from Donnie Darko - where he says when his dog got sick, she went to hide under the porch. “To die?” His therapist prompts him. “To be alone ” he corrects her pointedly. [0] That’s kind of what I want when I die too - I don’t think I want to be around other people when it happens. I want to have my final moments to face death on my own, without feeling like I have to perform for other peo…

Wow I’m the total opposite. I’m very annoyed to be around others most of the time, but upon dying I can’t imagine doing it alone or without the help of loved ones. A lot of motivation to be risk averse with my physical body in this life comes from a desire to make it to old age. Furthermore, I instantly understood why having children was good when I realized that they are your insurance that you’ll (usually) have som…

> I’m very annoyed to be around others most of the time, but upon dying I can’t imagine doing it alone or without the help of loved ones.

I'm the same but I'm trying to accept that while we are born among family, dying is a solitary journey.

(There is a saying along these lines, but search engines are utterly useless at surfacing it)

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#614
post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would posit that caring for helpless infants is an objective good. It’s not clear to me how I’d explain that to someone who doesn’t inherently understand it.

I agree with you that it is good to care for helpless infants. The fact that this cannot be clearly explained to someone who doesn’t inherently agree indicates that this is not an objective good, though. The devil’s advocate would probably also ask how it would be objectively good to protect baby Hilter, knowing that protecting his innocent infant life would lead directly to the deaths of millions.

The answer to that would be that if you have the ability to kill baby Hitler you would also have the ability to allow him into art school, it is an impossible absurd thought experiment after all.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#615

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s still absurd despite what you say that we are implying that we should euthanize another human because they have become difficult to manage due to illness. Where do we draw the line?

I am not implying that at all. People should be free to choose when to die, and people should be free to set conditions for their future wherein they no longer wish to live even if they could not express that at point. That's a personal choice. Anyone not interested in that won't have to do anything and can just wait for the end.

It's not that simple. Once the option is there, there is incentive to encourage people to take it when their continued existence would be a burden.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire issue they're pointing to is that deciding that someone's existence is sufficiently tormented is difficult and morally fraught.

If you visit an elderly care home you'll find plenty of people who express their wish that they don't want to live any longer. It's not getting better for them - they are just waiting for the day to come, often in agony.

And don't you think the solution to that should be to not ship your parents to a care home rather than finishing the job by euthanizing them?

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a cruel perspective, implying that he'd be better off dead, for what, 3 years of inconvenience to his community, despite the previous 80 years being spent contributing positively to it? You even literally show that he isn't solely remembered for those last 3 years of his life. We owe people like that care and understanding, not murder framed as mercy. It's always so painful to see old people around who a…

He’d be dead either way, the question is if having those three years were a net improvement to his life

Putting that up for discussion makes the world worse than any suffering that may be experienced during that time.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#618
post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've known at least 2 old persons who were literally looking forward to their death because of chronic pain and general boredom and frustration of requiring 24h/7 assistance and not being able to live the way they used to. They would have likely used assisted suicide if it had been an option back then.

In this case man doesn't want to die but others are suggesting it to make it easier on society.

Which is really the scariest part about this while discussion. Already plenty NPCs repeating how expensive it is to keep old people alive, it's not a matter of time until old people will be encouraged to make the right choice - or have it made for them if they are not capable of making it.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why there should be more nuance to the issue: legalizing suicide is not the same as legalizing assisted suicide. I want to be free to die on my own terms. Conversely, I do not want the healthcare system to be allowed to even suggest it.

The healthcare system should not be allowed to suggest it. And it should require an independent review if you request it. That doesn't mean the system shouldn't be allowed to provide it.

The healthcare system is financially incentivized to encourage you to do it. It must absolutely remain taboo for medical professionals to even think about the option.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#620

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I feel the desire to stay alive long enough to be a liability for yourself and those around you is a decision motivated by ego and fear, rather than compassion or logic. Everyone becomes a liability at some point. By that logic we should just go full Logan’s run and kill people as soon as they stop being productive. There nothing wrong with saying that you aren’t going to take extreme measures to preserve your life…

the big question is why do you get to choose that for me or why is it society's choice and not my own? assuming I'm of a healthy mental state.

Because we can't make it so that your choice isn't influenced by society.
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