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Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

reuters.com

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Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#611

Post by r3d0c »

omginternets wrote: post #340
r3d0c wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You're assuming these things are mentioned. "Hi, I'd like to book/confirm an appointment with Dr. Jones." doesn't leak information about "abortion". yes it does.. just look up who dr jones is; is the metadata going to say "this lady is getting an abortion" ?

I think you're nit-picking and failing to address the broader point. 1. The conversation may or may not contain information pertaining to an abortion. 2. The metadata (namely: "it's an abortion clinic") inherently contains such information. The point is that metadata is usually the more interesting data.

> inherently contains such information.

no it doesn't, it'll contain a phone number to a clinic, then you'll have to look up what kind of clinic it is

you're telling me the receptionist answering the phone at the clinic won't mention the name of the clinic when someone calls?

and stick to objective points and don't fault me by calling it nitpicking because your argument falls apart when basic critical thinking is applied to it

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#612

Post by mistermann »

somenameforme wrote: post #577
quantified wrote: post #566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No you can't. You only get to vote for the candidates on the ballot. And they'll get corrupted within a term, usually.

GP is being ironic. That said, I also think things happen way before the first term. It requires consent of the Party to get on the ballot and hundreds of millions of dollars, increasingly trending towards billions, to run a campaign with a chance of winning, because in a democracy it's quite self evident that the person who spends the most money, must be the better person. Results don't lie! And on top of all of thi…

Very much agree.

I would like to ask you a serious question: do you not think it is extremely weird that so many people will at least sometimes[1] agree that "democracy" is essentially fake, but then at other times take quite literally the opposite stance...praising it, defending it, singing its virtues, etc? Granted, it is theoretically possible that each individual is 100% consistent at all times, and I am simply observing people who are on different sides of the argument, but now and then I'll check into someone's post history and find evidence that pretty soundly rules that out (subjectivity noted).

A standard response to this is something along the lines of "Oh, that's people just being X (dumb, etc)", but I do not believe that is an even remotely accurate description of what is really going on. But for even more irony: on one hand, most people tend to think democracy, governance, and all the things downstream of it (ie: their literal experience here on Earth) is a very big deal (the passionate debate over what exactly the events of January 6 "were" is a prime example), yet it is almost impossible to get anyone to engage in a highly serious conversation about just what the fuck is going on here on Planet Earth, 2023. It is as if there is some sort of a yet to be discovered phenomenon in play.

Do you think I might be crazy? I very often genuinely feel like I am living in The Truman Show.

[1] I feel like this is a crucially important detail that is rarely investigated or even contemplated.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#613

Post by devinegan »

My startup (LaunchKey, now part of TransUnion) encrypted the data in our push authentication requests as late as a decade ago. This was painful until they expanded the size of the message allowing for more encrypted data. It is possible to do so (I would use pub/priv ec keys now) but remember you are limited in the amount of data you can include so you might need a “pull” to deliver all of the content necessary.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#614

Post by mcculley »

mandmandam wrote: post #610
mcculley wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently visited Manhattan and walked many miles touring it. The smell was in many places, with people smoking out in public. It is offensive and rude.

> It is offensive and rude. If you take one of the world's most popular pastimes that personally, and want it legislated against on that basis, I have no time for your arguments. Like - Manhattan. Yeah, you're gonna smell cannabis in Manhattan. It doesn't matter the tiniest bit what the laws are; you're gonna smell it. It's not something to take as a personal insult, and it's wild you insist that it is. Anyway, weren…

> If you take one of the world's most popular pastimes that personally, and want it legislated against on that basis, I have no time for your arguments.

Many popular activities are expected to be done where they do not impact others. In my local park, a man was arrested for masturbating in public, certainly a popular activity.

> It doesn't matter the tiniest bit what the laws are; you're gonna smell it.

Over the course of the last few decades, I smell it more in Manhattan and in many other places where it has been legalized. Apparently laws do matter. Not that I want any laws against it. I would just prefer that people not be assholes about it.

I did not interpret such sociopathic behavior as a "personal insult".

As for the more serious issue, I did not take the thread here. I replied to your comment, "OP is complaining that he might get a whiff coming from his neighbors house." I pointed out that one does not need to enter someone's house in order to be forced to inhale their smoke.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#615

Post by iwontberude »

gowld wrote: post #578
iwontberude wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Good thing there is no penalties for lying under oath anymore. That pesky rule of law was so long in the tooth.

Penalties for whom ? Clapper was bound by conflicting laws requiring both honesty and secrecy. This problem goes all the way to the root of government and legal system.

There are ways to respond to a question without violating secrecy and being dishonest. It’s like pleading the fifth, there are situations where it is acceptable to not tell the whole truth because it is counter to a law or personal right. In those instances the person needs to explicitly proclaim the basis in which they are obscuring the answer. Giving untruthful, absolute answers about the non-existence of something is inconsistent with the above.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#616

Post by standardUser »

crawfordcomeaux wrote: post #542
standardUser wrote: post #498

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And if they shoot you dead first, you're cool with that? For the cause?

I mean, I'm already a target for various things/reason. That's why I'm an advocate for viral movements so we hit a point where the movement's so large, we skip over the part of the process where killing us would be an effective means of stopping the movement. But yeah, I'm not going to let threat of death keep me from plowing forward. Embracing death is part of death practice. I'm still going to move forward playfull…

Personally, I think we have seen too much change within our system in my lifetime for me to think hundreds of thousands or millions of people should die in the off chance that we can change it to something remarkably better.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#617

Post by standardUser »

verisimi wrote: post #522
standardUser wrote: post #495

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want legislators to pass laws that prevent spying by the executive branch. I don't care who writes them.

But, who do you think sanctions this stuff in the first place? I think it's an insane expectation to think that government would sanction itself, when it is also requesting and enabling the ability to spy on citizens! I think you've read the government's self promotional material, and believe it - that it's trying to do the best for its citizens, keep people safe, etc as opposed to seeing it for what it is, which is…

There are countless examples of laws being passed that go against the presumed interest of the people passing them.

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#618

Post by DarkNova6 »

mistermann wrote: post #543
soraminazuki wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are instead life destroying penalties being handed out to whistleblowers. What a world we live in.

The good thing is we live in a democracy - if we don't like it, we can fix it at the voting booth.

From a European perspective, I am most cautious in calling a two party system a proper democracy.

It’s easy to game the system when there are only two sides to pay…

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#619

Post by rsync »

mistrial9 wrote: post #475
staplers wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple's own developer documentation outlines how notifications can trigger when crossing a physical boundary. Apps notifications can trigger if you enter a "protest zone" for example then gov will know everyone who was there.

California with the support of Gavin Newsom is building "no go" zones for wildfire response. Sounds OK except - a video recording of a local Mayor at a wildfire update press conference, asking with deference, when the main highway to his town will re-open, and the response from a tense and aggressive CHP leader was "maybe that road will be closed for six months, maybe next year" with no respect... instantly snapped a…

Do you have a link to this ?

I would like to see this interaction…

Re: Governments spying on Apple, Google users through push notifications

#620

Post by rsync »

beebeepka wrote: post #373
kome wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no it's more like: don’t have a smartphone and you are good (perhaps).

No, having a dumb phone is not enough. A malicious actor can pretend they need to deliver an SMS to you, which may result in a network disclosing your location (anywhere in the world). Mobile networks probably don't honour aggressive probing for just about any peer but it's not like nobody can do this at scale. None of this is new.

When Mallory sends an sms to my personal phone number, it goes to twilio.

The location is always the same.

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