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Korg PS-3300 is back

korg.co.uk

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Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#61

Post by Lio »

hjkl0 wrote: post #17

Very curious about the design, wish they’d show more photos and say more about it. Where are all those cables stored? Is the keyboard supposed to fold into the main case somehow? Reminds me a bit of the C100 “developer terminal”: https://caligra.com/c100/ (which I just noticed is now shipping)

Patch cables will need to be stored externally, as with other semi-modular synths. I've seen little cable hangers but it would be unusual to have that as part of the main design.

They say that it comes with a custom hard case to hold both the main unit and the keyboard.

Korg worked previously with David Friend of Arp and the Alan R Pearlman Foundation to reissue the Arp 2600 and Arp Odyssey. The Arp 2600 Full Size design is somewhat similar to this, although smaller, in that it comes with its own flight cases.

I have Korg's smaller still Arp 2600M reisslue and that came with a suitcase and foam inserts to hold the main unit, keyboard, patch cables and sequencer.

I get the impression that the PS-3300 is meant to be set up permanently in one place like a studio rather than being gigged.

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#62

Post by steve1977 »

bayindirh wrote: post #39
steve1977 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don't need to churn out stuff. They just want to show off what they possess.

You're exactly right. Let me support you by adding some examples: - Look Mum No Computer: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLluPQLh1xzlLcJd9CbAxE... - Caught in Joy: https://www.youtube.com/@CaughtInJoy They just show their stuff, and what they can do with these. No talent, just show. /s

Look Mum No Computer is interesting.

On one hand, he's a bad example, because - at least as far as I know - he builds most of the stuff himself. So he's not showing off expensive synths he bought, which makes this kind of a category error.

On the other hand, he's a great example, because in terms of his musical output, he's a quite bland epigone of artists like Howard Jones or Thomas Dolby of the 80s. And in the playlist you linked of Wendy Carlos.

Now the thing is, I love Howard Jones, Thomas Dolby and Wendy Carlos. But they exist already. I don't need a copy. That's exactly the point I was trying to make.

I don't need yet another YouTuber recreating Axel F. on his freshly bought Jupiter-8. I want new Axel Fs!

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#63

Post by steve1977 »

kristianp wrote: post #47
steve1977 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well it's remake of an old synthesizer, there's plenty of information and pictures about the original.

The remake isn't going to be exactly the same as the original. It is sensible to want more photos of the new units.

Not 100% exactly, but the whole point of these Korg reissues is to be very close to the originals. So in terms of general architecture, it will be the same.

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#64

Post by bayindirh »

steve1977 wrote: post #62
bayindirh wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're exactly right. Let me support you by adding some examples: - Look Mum No Computer: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLluPQLh1xzlLcJd9CbAxE... - Caught in Joy: https://www.youtube.com/@CaughtInJoy They just show their stuff, and what they can do with these. No talent, just show. /s

Look Mum No Computer is interesting. On one hand, he's a bad example, because - at least as far as I know - he builds most of the stuff himself. So he's not showing off expensive synths he bought, which makes this kind of a category error. On the other hand, he's a great example, because in terms of his musical output, he's a quite bland epigone of artists like Howard Jones or Thomas Dolby of the 80s. And in the play…

He's a great DIYer and explorer of sounds, so that part is true.

However, he's not a sole YouTuber who imitates 80s music to put out videos. The videos are a mere side product.

He builds stuff, experiments and sets up museums[0], or even restores old cars[1]. When I first stumbled upon him, he was restoring old musical instruments in a warehouse and that place was a makeshift museum of sorts.

I believe he doesn't care if his musical output or taste doesn't meet someone's expectations, he's just being himself, and I like him being just that. Maybe he is not breaking new musical grounds, but he's thinking very outside the box while being a tonal copy of somebody else, and this is certainly something.

He would probably buy one of these, or clone it himself, just because he wants to, and this makes him the target audience of this squarely.

[0]: https://www.lookmumnocomputer.com/projects#/this-museum-is-n...

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/@lookmumnoengine

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#65

Post by spiffx »

ButlerianJihad wrote: post #42
alwa wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless, of course, Cameron Carpenter is involved: https://archive.is/DQQq0 https://www.marshallandogletree.com/opus8 …though it was in fact maintenance costs that did in the I.T.O., may it rest in peace… > “It travels in a 53-foot truck,” he says. “It has workshop and carpenter facilities that travel with the organ at all times. It has a massive accoutrement of spare parts. And it has two sound systems.” > The system…

No, no no. I am sorry to burst your bubble here, but that electronic organ is most definitely not a pipe organ. These are two completely different types of instruments. It is perfectly fine to take a gigantic electronic organ, its manual, its accessories, and box it up and drop it into whatever "enclosure" you have booked for a concert. Because an electronic organ is not intricately intertwined with its enclosing bui…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Bridge_station_organ

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#66

Post by otabdeveloper4 »

Lio wrote: post #58
otabdeveloper4 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's for collectors. There's no musical value in a polyphonic analogue synthesizer.

This is the oddest statement I've read in a while. How is there "no musical value in a polyphonic analogue synthesizer"? There's a lot of unique music written using polyphonic analogue synths. Enough that people clearly like the sounds of subtractive synthesis. If they were only used just to playback tracks written in the 70s, 80s and 90s then they would still have value. The growth of cheap analogue synths proves it…

Sorry, I can't make any sense of your comment.

"Polyphonic analogue synth" means several independent envelope generators and VCFs.

Doing this is pointless -- it increases your synth's costs by orders of magnitude and provides no musical benefit whatsoever except make it slightly easier for piano players with no synthesizer experience to play it.

> The growth of cheap analogue synths

Yes, but literally none of them are doing analogue polyphony. The entire idea is just massively stupid and makes no sense in the 21st century.

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#67

Post by [deleted] »

fxj wrote: post #41

There is a free emulator here: https://www.fullbucket.de/music/fb3300.html The PS-3300 is a 3 layer synth with 49 voices where each voice has its own VCO/VCF/VCA. So you end up with 16 voices when you use 3 layers. It has microtunality and a reverb for each of the layers. Here is a sound demo: https://soundcloud.com/full-bucket/fr33ze?utm_source=clipboa...

[deleted]

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#68

Post by steve1977 »

mathgeek wrote: post #55
gizajob wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Zero clue who would find the need to pay $2700 for that.

Very little of lifestyle products is about need. Folks will open their wallets for some combination of personal wants, exclusivity (or the illusion of it), or even something as simple as a coffee table discussion piece. These sorts of "collectible clones" are pretty popular at the moment. A big part of it is nostalgia.

Nostalgia and also specifically catering to people who are affluent enough now to afford things they couldn't afford as kids or teens.

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#69

Post by Lio »

otabdeveloper4 wrote: post #66
Lio wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the oddest statement I've read in a while. How is there "no musical value in a polyphonic analogue synthesizer"? There's a lot of unique music written using polyphonic analogue synths. Enough that people clearly like the sounds of subtractive synthesis. If they were only used just to playback tracks written in the 70s, 80s and 90s then they would still have value. The growth of cheap analogue synths proves it…

Sorry, I can't make any sense of your comment. "Polyphonic analogue synth" means several independent envelope generators and VCFs. Doing this is pointless -- it increases your synth's costs by orders of magnitude and provides no musical benefit whatsoever except make it slightly easier for piano players with no synthesizer experience to play it. > The growth of cheap analogue synths Yes, but literally none of them ar…

What is it that you don't understand?

> Yes, but literally none of them are doing analogue polyphony.

That's simply not true.

Korg Minilogue, Mililogue XD, Prologue, Behringer Pro-800, Sequential Take 5, Prophet Rev2, Prophet-10, Arturia PolyBrute 12, Oberheim OB-X8, Moog One and many more.

Polyphonic analogue synths are popular and very useful actually.

Re: Korg PS-3300 is back

#70

Post by blt »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #36
blt wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably some of both, but 11k is extremely reasonable for this. If I understand correctly, it has 3x complete subtractive synths per key (not just 3 oscillators into 1 filter) x 49 keys. A typical analog polyphonic synth has maybe 8 voices. The comparison is more like bulldozer vs. car than BMW vs. Toyota - entirely new capabilities are unlocked

I want to say I agree, but since this is 50 year old tech, wouldn't there be newer mass produced products that do the same thing at a fraction of the price? Even if purely analog it would benefit from economies of scale, miniaturization, etc.

I'm not a synth designer or analog IC engineer, but from my limited knowledge:

Most polyphonic synths use individual chips for the main building blocks such as voltage-controlled oscillators, filters, and amplifiers, such as https://www.cabintechglobal.com/as3350-smt. Those are simple analog circuits, but the specific designs that work for synths are not really useful for anything else, so they are a boutique and expensive (relative to complexity) chip. Using those: N chips per voice x 49 keys x 3 voices per key = 147*N expensive chips.

There are also some "whole synth on a chip" available like https://www.cabintechglobal.com/as3394-smt at ~$10 each. So best case is ~$1.5k in chips alone for the core of this synth. Some other support circuits are still needed. Then $$$ for big PCBs and a big, noise-free linear power supply.

But even if we could drive the electronics costs down, that doesn't affect the per-unit cost of front panel controls, keybed, or the wood cabinet. Nor the per-unit cost of manufacturing labor, packaging, logistics. Nor the per-project cost of R&D and manufacturing tooling. All of these scale with size and complexity.

So it's no different from other specialized goods - the price gap relative to the "good enough" baseline will always be more than the performance gap suggests because the specialized version inherently sells fewer #units and cannot activate the same economies of scale.

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