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The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

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Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#61

Post by saubeidl »

PeterStuer wrote: post #46
asyx wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are not unelected. They might be appointed but the parliament is elected and can block this. Go vote in EU elections. A parliament that is not full of conservatives can block this.

The EU is not some US from 30 years ago. It is not "conservatives" that push these totalitarian proposals over here. Look at the DSA voting record. Digital Services Act: https://howtheyvote.eu/votes/139040

The DSA is not totalitarian, has nothing to do with this proposal and is generally a good thing. Please don't muddy the waters.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#62

Post by FerretFred »

westpfelia wrote: post #14

"the EU wants to scan your messages" implies its every member state and not one freak from Denmark putting this forward where it will die. The EU has always been 90 days from passing mass surveliance for the last decade. Until member states start actually backing this these articles are nothing but click bait.

I'm sure this is what they said about the UK Inline Safety Act (2023) but guess what, it's here, and live.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#63

Post by thyristan »

chedabob wrote: post #49
jeroenhd wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By banning real encryption, the police can arrest anyone using chat apps they can't control. Them not being able to spy on you automatically makes you guilty. Also something something children something terrorism something something safety, whatever makes the uninformed public feel like this is something that'll benefit them.

The criminals will just use something that hides in plain sight. I think it was Encrochat devices that booted into a fairly vanilla looking OS, and there was another platform where it was hidden in something like a calculator app.

It isn't about criminals. It is about population control. Keeping the plebs in their place, lest they vote unsavoury opposition parties, or get ideas about real democratic participation.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#64

Post by pjerem »

chedabob wrote: post #49
jeroenhd wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By banning real encryption, the police can arrest anyone using chat apps they can't control. Them not being able to spy on you automatically makes you guilty. Also something something children something terrorism something something safety, whatever makes the uninformed public feel like this is something that'll benefit them.

The criminals will just use something that hides in plain sight. I think it was Encrochat devices that booted into a fairly vanilla looking OS, and there was another platform where it was hidden in something like a calculator app.

You mean, EncroChat, the company that was infiltrated by cops which led to 4500 arrests ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EncroChat

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#65

Post by grues-dinner »

FirmwareBurner wrote: post #35
ekianjo wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it only needs to pass once. if you keep trying it will.

"You need to be lucky every time to stop us, but we only need to be lucky once"

Ironic that this was said by the IRA to the Conservatives in the UK, after they narrowly missed bombing Thatcher. Maybe they learned from it, since that strategy is how they eventually got the OSA pushed through.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#66

Post by concinds »

westpfelia wrote: post #14

"the EU wants to scan your messages" implies its every member state and not one freak from Denmark putting this forward where it will die. The EU has always been 90 days from passing mass surveliance for the last decade. Until member states start actually backing this these articles are nothing but click bait.

In previous EU presidencies it's only been defeated by a slim margin, in part thanks to grassroots pressure. The attitude of the governments in favor of it has been: "whatever, we'll keep trying and we'll get it eventually".

So getting upset that people talk about it when it gets tabled once again is illogical and unjustifiable.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#67

Post by lifestyleguru »

mortarion wrote: post #37

Nothing will come of this. Germany, for some reason, really doesn't like the idea of monitoring citizens messages. Anything that eventually passes will be extremely toothless.

They equally don't like their private messages being scanned as they like to peek at others'. Personally don't look at mine but my job is looking at yours, nothing personal.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#68

Post by richrichardsson »

westpfelia wrote: post #54
jb1991 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK, I’ll bite. What reason would there be to paint every bird orange?

There isnt. Its a crazy example of what is happening here. To use a real world example take this "EU deal" that Trump did. Everyone is talking like its already taken effect. But the reality is the EU just handshake agreed to this, but at the end of the day all of the member states have to rattify it. And if states dont or if there are arguements made the whole thing gets tossed. I just wish people would say that they…

> I just wish people would say that they dont understand how the EU works.

Just look at the Brexit vote for an example of how little people understand the EU and how it works.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#69

Post by wobfan »

EagnaIonat wrote: post #57
an_ko wrote: post #17

Why does this stupid idea have to be killed so many times? Being watched constantly means living in fear, but seeing it almost become legally mandated practice over and over again is itself a form of living in fear. I'm so tired.

It was more misunderstood than stupid. Ironically when Apple introduced their solution it was actually better than what we have now. It was interesting to watch people lose their minds because they didn't understand how the current or proposed system worked. Current system everything can be decrypted on the cloud and is scanned for CSAM by all ISPs/service providers. Apple wanted the device to scan for CSAM and if it…

> Realistically if countries want to read encrypted messages, they can already do so.

How? Are you implying adynchronous and synchronous encryption is broken? Because last time I checked since Snowden our encryption is basically the one single thing in the whole concept of the internet that has been done very right, with forward secrecy and long term security in mind. AFAIK there are no signs that someone or something has been able to break it.

Also, the solutions you present do imply that someone already has the private key to decrypt. Sure, they'll say they'll just decrypt if your a bad person, but the definition of a bad person changes from government to government (see USA), and from CEO to CEO. Encryption should and mostly is built on zero trust and it only works with zero trust. Scanning, and risking the privacy of billions and billions of messages by having the key to read them because there have been some bad actors is fighting a fly with a bazooka. Which sounds funny overkill, but, fun fact, it also just doesn't work. It destroys a lot, and gains nothing.

I don't have a better solution for the problem. But this solution is definitely the wrong one.

Re: The EU could be scanning your chats by October 2025

#70

Post by kubb »

eitland wrote: post #58
kubb wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People should learn about crying wolf, but they never do.

Crying wolf implies there is no wolf. Here the wolf is clearly visible.

The wolf are the nefarious powers trying to read your DMs.

When they really come, people won’t bother reading the news.

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