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Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
61–70 of 111 posts
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#62Obvious disclaimer first: I do not condone imagery of child abuse, I believe this guy has some kind of psychological problem and needs professional help, AI-generated deepfakes can actually cause real harm and proper regulation is needed. With that out of the way: > the generative AI wrinkle in this particular arrest shows how technology is generating new avenues for crime and child abuse. Is it really child abuse if…
> Is it really child abuse if no children were involved? The "harm" principle which is very popular these days to see if things are bad or good or punishable or not, I think it has a lot of problems. There are a lot of things that don't map onto this principle well. Social cohesion is a huge one. Something may not directly harm someone, but it can harm the fabric of society and many other things.
On the other hand, a government that makes victimless actions into major crimes also destroys social cohesion as it means the law is clearly detached from what is just.
By all means, fast track the death penalty for child rapists. Even make a constitutional amendment allowing cruel and unusual punishments for that single crime. Treat paying for actual abuse images as a worse crime than commissioning a murder. Sky's the limit for actual abusers. But (legally) punishing the creation of fake imagery is absurd, and in practice punishing possession seems to be unhealthy for a free society.
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#63So now is not downloading pics, but downloading AI models that can generate it. Are there people fine tuning models with these illegal images? Or is it just a jail broken model. In the former case the fine tuner needs to be traced, the latter case is new law territory
I suspect that most open image models are capable of creating illegal images without fine tuning (though perhaps with significant effort). Models are capable of generating images containing subject matter that has never been depicted by any human ever. It's not hard to imagine that a model that can produce images of nude bodies could adapt the apparent age of those bodies.
The legal challenges here will be important to follow.
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#64Obvious disclaimer first: I do not condone imagery of child abuse, I believe this guy has some kind of psychological problem and needs professional help, AI-generated deepfakes can actually cause real harm and proper regulation is needed. With that out of the way: > the generative AI wrinkle in this particular arrest shows how technology is generating new avenues for crime and child abuse. Is it really child abuse if…
It's no different than the logic behind medication regulation. Some substances are known to induce bad/undesirable/harmful behavior and need to have access restricted. There may be a scientific argument about whether or not the argument is correct in this particular case, but the legal paradigm is sound. Yes, basically. You can absolutely criminalize fake images.
I would say the difference between drugs and images is that the first amendment doesn’t protect drugs. This then becomes an argument about the limits of the first amendment.
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Is it really child abuse if no children were involved? How can you prove that zero children were involved at any point? How does the model generate CSAM without it either being in the training material or fed to the model as an input?
It somehow generates flying pigs without them existing. Substitute pigs for an other animal if your next argument is that flying pigs might be in the database.
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Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#66Obvious disclaimer first: I do not condone imagery of child abuse, I believe this guy has some kind of psychological problem and needs professional help, AI-generated deepfakes can actually cause real harm and proper regulation is needed. With that out of the way: > the generative AI wrinkle in this particular arrest shows how technology is generating new avenues for crime and child abuse. Is it really child abuse if…
> Is it really child abuse if no children were involved? Does that mean that AI-generated imagery of some protected group being harmed causes actual harm to that protected group? Not saying it doesn't, but it may be worth thinking about. Deepfakes of real children is real children being involved. Outside of that, my response is, “how would you create a compelling CSAM image with nothing resembling the target in the t…
>> how would you create a compelling CSAM image with nothing resembling the target in the training data?
(1) You feed it extra training data to suit the desired output.
(2) The AI combines bits from existing training data. It has non-pornographic content of children. It has adult pornography. Layer one over the other and voila. Crime. Most AI has zero images of cats doing calculus, but is very capable of generating such content.
(3) You manually aid the process. People forget how powerful standalone AI can be when one manually selects good output and feeds it back as a guide for the next iteration. This does not scale to a multi-task environment, but is very useful when accomplishing one specific task.
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#67Obvious disclaimer first: I do not condone imagery of child abuse, I believe this guy has some kind of psychological problem and needs professional help, AI-generated deepfakes can actually cause real harm and proper regulation is needed. With that out of the way: > the generative AI wrinkle in this particular arrest shows how technology is generating new avenues for crime and child abuse. Is it really child abuse if…
I guess renders or cartoons of child pornography is equally banned, so I guess that's not a defence here, as the law stands.
I think they are legal in the US as long as the render or drawing is not depicting a real person.
Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
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Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#69Re: Man Arrested for Creating Child Porn Using AI
#70In the US if I get caught selling you a gram of pure cocaine I get the same punishment as I would if I sold you a gram that’s only 20% pure. If I sold you a gram of some random powder and told you it is cocaine I am likely to be prosecuted all the same whether I knew it was fake or not.
That aside, the “fully synthetic CSAM with no children involved at all” idea relies very, very heavily on taking the word of the guy who you just busted with a hard drive full of CSAM.
His defense would essentially have to be “Your honor I pinky swear that I used the txt2img tab of automatic1111 instead of the img2img tab” or “I did start with real CSAM but the img2img tab acts as an algorithmic magic wand imbued with the power to retroactively erase the previous harm caused by the source material”
There is no coherent defense to this activity that boils down to anything other than the idea that the existence of image generators should — and does — constitute an acceptable means of laundering CSAM and/or providing plausible deniability for anyone caught with it.
The idea that there would be any pushback to arresting or investigating people for distributing this stuff boggles the mind. Inventing a new type of armor to specifically protect child abusers from scrutiny is a choice, not some sort of emergent moral ground truth caused by the popularization of diffusion models.