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Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

science.org

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Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#61

Post by ssorallen »

piokoch wrote: post #49

This is bollocks. Typical clickbait title. There is still a lot of unsolved problems in physics, both experimental and theoretical. Particle physics is just one branch of science (and rather boring, if you ask me), popularized by CERN marketing, so people think new physics equals finding some new particle. There is a lot of interesting problems waiting for exploration. I will not even try to list them "unsolved physi…

This is clickbait to someone in particle physics?

It describes the standard model, what the LHC was able to find, what it hasn’t been able to find, and why there is skepticism about further discoveries. This is some high quality clickbait.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#62

Post by macspoofing »

throw457 wrote: post #16
mr_mitm wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> James Clerk Maxwell united electricity and magnetism with a pen and paper. Einstein discovered special and general relativity in the same way. > Has theoretical physics advanced enough now that such pen and paper discoveries are all but over, and the only way to continue making progress is to dedicate an ever larger share of the global economy's productive capacity to building larger and more expensive experiments?…

The LHC cost was 2% of the yearly revenue of Apple I am fairly certain that we can "afford" it.

Apparently the next-gen LHC replacement will cost on the order of $100 billion. As a society (US, EU, or global), we can certainly 'afford it', but no-one is going to be writing that check anytime soon.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#63

Post by bmitc »

sdfhdhjdw3 wrote: post #28

Oh jesus christ, the constant whining! This is science. This is how it works. Maybe there's nothing else to discover, maybe it will take us 100 years, we don't know, that's why it's called research.

Funding is not infinite.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#64

Post by Certhas »

sdfhdhjdw3 wrote: post #28

Oh jesus christ, the constant whining! This is science. This is how it works. Maybe there's nothing else to discover, maybe it will take us 100 years, we don't know, that's why it's called research.

You are mischaracterize what's happening entirely. The article is not whining and it's not claiming that this is somehow shaking the foundations of science. But we are potentially in the middle (or even at the end) of a monumental shift inside physics. Particle physics produced fantastic discoveries over the second half of the twentieth century and it might just have hit a major major wall (or in the lingo of the field, encountered a desert) where we can not expect new discoveries in the next decades or centuries.

If that's so it will mean a major restructuring of the field of physics. It has vast implications for researchers that chose what to work on or whom to fund. Yes it's all part of research, but the flavor and type of research in one of the most prominent fields of science is undergoing a massive shift. That's news that's well suited for a publication called Science. And it reflects genuine scientific debate that's been going on for more than a decade on the inside.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#67

Post by japanuspus »

pizzaknife wrote: post #34
sdfhdhjdw3 wrote: post #28

Oh jesus christ, the constant whining! This is science. This is how it works. Maybe there's nothing else to discover, maybe it will take us 100 years, we don't know, that's why it's called research.

literally my sentiments exactly. Next thing you know, someone will be clamoring to make the LHC a profit center and complain about its solvency! edit: I have no dog in the fight, but I do appreciate the concept of "Art for Art's sake." To me, the LHC embodies the physics equiv of that statement.

You do realize that most of the money for LHC end up in industry, not academia?

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#68

Post by denton-scratch »

nemo44x wrote: post #29
bamboozled wrote: post #19

Why would this be a nightmare, isn't this good? They know they're going down the wrong path and can probably correct?

True but you’d hate to be the physicist that spent their career going down the wrong path only to see tomorrows physicists discover the big breakthroughs and the realization that your contribution will be sent to the dustbin of history.

Yah. Well, for most of us, the prospect of making a significant contribution to the sum of human knowledge is a faint prospect.

They say all political careers end in failure. Very few politicians die in the saddle, or simply retire. Most of them are destroyed. My guess is that most careers in science research end similarly; lots of career-length research projects fail to achieve their goals, and very few scientists get Nobels for world-changing discoveries.

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#69

Post by xoac »

fithisux wrote: post #43

They could open projects in a git hosting site, publish their code in a polished form. They can even contribute to various projects related to their work. Or create a data hosting service for others to examine them.

Yeah also they could create a new javascript framework

Re: Ten years after the Higgs, physicists face the nightmare of finding nothing else

#70

Post by tokai »

sdfhdhjdw3 wrote: post #28

Oh jesus christ, the constant whining! This is science. This is how it works. Maybe there's nothing else to discover, maybe it will take us 100 years, we don't know, that's why it's called research.

Which whining? From the article:

>It’s too early to despair, many physicists say

or

>“I very much doubt that in 20 years, I will say, ‘Oh, boy, after the Higgs discovery we learned nothing new.’”

The whole article is about how the upgrade to the LHC will give more precision and more data. Even if it was whining, critiquing and bickering over the status quo very much a cornerstone of science. Your annoyance looks like something coming from a place of dogmatism..

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