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Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

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Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#61

Post by zaidf »

rockya wrote: post #57
netcan wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think clearer messaging would fix this? Seems to me like a problem only if it seems to people that this business is offering the deal. If its clear that isn't the case, would you still have issues with this?

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me. Many manufacturers have MAP guidelines so that they don't get to be perceived as bargain basement providers. Some (e.g. Bose) also require that their products be excluded from all storewide discounts. They have high affinity and a premium value and want to protect that. Sam claimed that they posted what they think is a reasonable…

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me.

That's a much broader net than this specific issue.

Run of the mill coupon websites have been associating businesses with coupon/discount verbiage for a long time, some even profitably.

To be clear, where do you stand on verbiage such as "If x people vote to request a 50% off coupon at Premium Brand, we will talk to Premium Brand."

Personally I have no problem with this - it may screw up the premium brand when it comes to SEO but that is Team Google's problem to improve search quality.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#62

Post by rockya »

netcan wrote: post #60
rockya wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me. Many manufacturers have MAP guidelines so that they don't get to be perceived as bargain basement providers. Some (e.g. Bose) also require that their products be excluded from all storewide discounts. They have high affinity and a premium value and want to protect that. Sam claimed that they posted what they think is a reasonable…

Again, I think it may be about messaging. The problem comes from the association with daily deal sites. If you think about it (and communicate it clearly) as an offer/demand/bargaining attempt and less like an existing discount/offer, which it is not, I'm not sure there would be a problem. Imagine the business had started this way: You have lots of friends who like to do the kind of stuff they're promoting. You have…

That negotiation happens in private and some businesses might be willing to entertain that.

The fact that this happens in the open has significant potential to devalue the brand.

Under very specific conditions, I will do free or discounted consulting. But I don't want "free" or $25/hour associated with my brand when someone does a Google search.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#63

Post by rockya »

zaidf wrote: post #61
rockya wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me. Many manufacturers have MAP guidelines so that they don't get to be perceived as bargain basement providers. Some (e.g. Bose) also require that their products be excluded from all storewide discounts. They have high affinity and a premium value and want to protect that. Sam claimed that they posted what they think is a reasonable…

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me. That's a much broader net than this specific issue. Run of the mill coupon websites have been associating businesses with coupon/discount verbiage for a long time, some even profitably. To be clear, where do you stand on verbiage such as "If x people vote to request a 50% off coupon at Premium Brand, we will talk to Premium Brand.…

a) Coupon/discount verbiage is typically done with the consent of the business.

b) Please try doing this with Bose and Apple. Let me know how it works out.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#64

Post by zaidf »

rockya wrote: post #63
zaidf wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Associating discounts with businesses who haven't agreed to them is problematic for me. That's a much broader net than this specific issue. Run of the mill coupon websites have been associating businesses with coupon/discount verbiage for a long time, some even profitably. To be clear, where do you stand on verbiage such as "If x people vote to request a 50% off coupon at Premium Brand, we will talk to Premium Brand.…

a) Coupon/discount verbiage is typically done with the consent of the business. b) Please try doing this with Bose and Apple. Let me know how it works out.

http://www.retailmenot.com/view/apple.com

http://www.retailmenot.com/view/bose.com

http://www.bargainist.com/deals/stores/amazon/#b

http://dealspl.us/zappos-coupons

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#65

Post by extension »

sama wrote: post #14

We're trying something new and innovative, and of course we'll have to iterate on it. We're moving as quickly as we can to fix this and make it work for consumers and businesses--obviously, it doesn't work for us unless it works for both of those groups. We have a chance to really improve local commerce, and I hope we do. As soon as a business wants to opt out, we block them permanently in the system and remove any p…

I think it's a great idea.

The only problem here is the deceptive presentation. If the site was crystal clear about how it works then you wouldn't have to apologize to anybody. There's nothing wrong with a bunch of people getting together to ask for group discounts.

Just be upfront about the scheme. I think people will go for it.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#66

Post by rockya »

zaidf wrote: post #64
rockya wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

a) Coupon/discount verbiage is typically done with the consent of the business. b) Please try doing this with Bose and Apple. Let me know how it works out.

http://www.retailmenot.com/view/apple.com http://www.retailmenot.com/view/bose.com http://www.bargainist.com/deals/stores/amazon/#b http://dealspl.us/zappos-coupons

Those are compilations of actual deals offered by the merchant, not stuff that was made up by others deciding what sort of discount a merchant might offer.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#67

Post by suhail »

You guys really need to think about the chance that it actually works. Loopt isn't some shady company trying to steal people's credit card information for something malicious. Their goal, in the end, is something benevolent for all parties.

If they fail (which is likely for any startup) then it's because the idea wasn't a good. It stands to reason that they can make this clear to both parties: consumers and businesses. If they didn't at this point then I am sure they'll fix it because ultimately everyone actually will be angry. The market will answer so you need not worry. I am sure Loopt has done a sufficient amount of customer development before exhausting all their engineering bandwidth, marketing resources, and product focus--meaning you should consider giving them the benefit of the doubt.

Let businesses decide. It's not something you're capable of proving. Loopt likely is gaining more feedback about it then you realize.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#68

Post by clobber »

potatolicious wrote: post #28
repos wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can companies really opt out of Get Satisfaction, or will they always be presented with the "Company X has not yet committed to open conversations about its products or services." If Loopt explicitly allows companies to opt out (and prevent the creation of deals for that company) then perhaps the service might be beneficial (companies that opt in to stay may get valuable feedback of what the consumer wants/would be w…

I'm not quite so confident about this idea. To me, all you will get are people voting for discounts at places they already frequent. This is not a good measure of what customers want, nor the prices they're willing to bear for these goods and services. I may be willing to pay $3 for a latte from my favourite coffee shop... but you're damn right I'm going to vote yes on $1 coffee. Why wouldn't I? This is going to resu…

New customers that never return.

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#69

Post by chailatte »

I don't understand why Paul thinks so highly of Sam Altman, supposedly a guy with a 40 year old soul [1], that he even made him partner at yc.

I saw plenty of writhing away from the blame (It's a bug!), instead of admitting his mistake and apologizing publicly.

I saw a lame joke written by Sam in this thread (shortly pulled after by the author) that was something to the effects of "I wouldn't help clean his house, he clearly doesn't like me".

If I saw all this and I was on the board, I would've already called a quick board meeting to replace the current CEO.

[1] http://www.paulgraham.com/notnot.html

Re: Sam Altman will clean your house for $5

#70

Post by rockya »

chailatte wrote: post #69

I don't understand why Paul thinks so highly of Sam Altman, supposedly a guy with a 40 year old soul [1], that he even made him partner at yc. I saw plenty of writhing away from the blame (It's a bug!), instead of admitting his mistake and apologizing publicly. I saw a lame joke written by Sam in this thread (shortly pulled after by the author) that was something to the effects of "I wouldn't help clean his house, he…

I noticed that too. That comment was pulled right as I (author of original post) entered the thread.

I repeat... I have nothing personal against Sam. Never met the guy.

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