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The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

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Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#61

Post by yesenadam »

apostacy wrote: post #51
ismaildonmez wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My other comment pointing out collusion of Facebook and the Turkish government is heavily downvoted, and I am not sure why. If I am mistaken, please someone let me know. Fellow Turkish trolls are doing extra duty on this thread :-)

> Fellow Turkish trolls are doing extra duty on this thread :-) If I got something wrong, anyone please feel free to correct me instead of just downvoting. If I only get downvoted but nobody can tell me what I'm wrong about, it is just brigading. And that can backfire, because if this is happening to seemingly reasonable comments, it strongly implies that those downvoting me are not capable of countering what I said.

Please don't comment about the voting on comments. It never does any good, and it makes boring reading.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#62

Post by hans1729 »

m00dy wrote: post #59
zero_deg_kevin wrote: post #55

The downvoting in this thread is insane. Do the mods have tools to determine if there are state actors trying to manipulate conversation on HN?

well, I'm not a state actor and I am a developer. So, I'm not working for state. I wouldn't come here to speculate if I were a state actor. I'm here to tell you my opinions as a Turk and my comments should be considered as a part of freedom expression which is one of the core values in western societies.

>not a state actor

>speaking on behalf of your nationality

Whats the state of freedom of expression in Turkey btw?

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#63

Post by joelbluminator »

m00dy wrote: post #59
zero_deg_kevin wrote: post #55

The downvoting in this thread is insane. Do the mods have tools to determine if there are state actors trying to manipulate conversation on HN?

well, I'm not a state actor and I am a developer. So, I'm not working for state. I wouldn't come here to speculate if I were a state actor. I'm here to tell you my opinions as a Turk and my comments should be considered as a part of freedom expression which is one of the core values in western societies.

As a turk you are pro genocide?

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#64

Post by hh3k0 »

habibur wrote: post #43
throwawaymylove wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder when the US will fully recognize the North American Native Genocide and build a monument in DC - hopefully in proportion to the monument in NYC.

I have bad feeling Turkey's president might go that route and bring it up as a retaliation.

Two times genocide awareness for the price of one, so to speak? I'll take it. Erdogan wouldn't have noble motives if he'd bring it up now, that much is clear -- but for once something worthwhile may stem from his ill intentions.

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#65

Post by anonu »

The story here is an age-old struggle of East vs West, and more specifically of Christianity vs Islam.

The parallels with the past, centuries before the Genocide, and the present, are clear. This is a battle that will continue.

I support the US's long overdue stance on the matter. It is important to remember what it symbolizes. I wished we lived in a kinder, gentler world. But we have atrocities occurring all over the globe, even in 2021. The US should standup for marginalized people, wherever they are.

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#66

Post by KenanuReeves »

grahamjpark wrote: post #4

Interestingly this is the second article I’ve seen today about Armenia: https://foreignpolicy.com/2021/04/24/armenia-azerbaijan-war-...

Today is the Armenian Genocide Remembrance Day https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide_Remembrance_...

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#67

Post by bayindirh »

andrewvc wrote: post #57
zero_deg_kevin wrote: post #55

The downvoting in this thread is insane. Do the mods have tools to determine if there are state actors trying to manipulate conversation on HN?

There are clearly disingenuous comments from genocide denying trolls throughout this thread. I’m not surprised to see downvotes as well.

Hi, I'm one of these genocide denying trolls. Let me tell you a story.

In 1915, my father's family was living in Erzurum. While the men of the house were leaving for the mosque after the law passed, they warned the woman at home about not opening the door for whatever reason.

Their neighbors were Armenians for 40+ years and my father's family were their landlords. They never had anything unpleasant, but they wanted to be cautious nevertheless.

After they left, their neighbors came to say farewell. They opened the door. They killed everyone at home. Then the Armenians went to the mosque, killed all men there. Then burned the mosque down.

We recall this incident as war times, shit happens and never make a big issue of it. I personally had Armenian friends (we've grown apart, just life happened, nothing else). I never had any problems with them, and never will, but this "you planned and executed an ethnic cleansing" stuff is one-sided.

It was war, it was ugly. There are other factors at play, but I don't want to dig deeper. It's a big ugly hole which burnt everyone, and as a planet we should leave this ugly thing behind, because it became a political weapon of sorts.

We can discuss if everyone leaves the hate aside and talk over it. Unless that time comes, this is my only comment on that issue.

Also, I want to re-iterate that I don't hate any human being just because they've born under a certain flag, and I don't want revenge or anything. I just want to be able talk about this without being labeled this and that.

Have a nice day.

Edit: Downvoting won't bring my family back, thanks.

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#69

Post by JadeNB »

habibur wrote: post #43
throwawaymylove wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder when the US will fully recognize the North American Native Genocide and build a monument in DC - hopefully in proportion to the monument in NYC.

I have bad feeling Turkey's president might go that route and bring it up as a retaliation.

What's so bad about it? Retaliatory historical honesty is a price I'm happy to pay. Better to have the stories told somewhere out there in the world, no matter the reason.

Re: The Armenian Genocide (1915-16): In Depth

#70

Post by scythe »

It's interesting how some genocides become more politically charged than others. Japan has trouble acknowledging their genocides, but they rarely complain when other countries do. America is generally similar. Germany has conducted a massive campaign to root out genocidal sympathies.

But it's particularly surprising with Turkey, because, unlike Japan or the US, the Republic of Turkey replaced the Ottoman Empire by a violent revolution. They have more of an excuse than most countries to claim they are not the direct political descendants of the genocidaires.

So it seems reasonable to infer that Turkey's rationale for denying the Armenian genocide is not to save face, but rather is rooted in resentment for what Turks see as a long campaign by France and England to weaken them and constrain their influence in the Mediterranean. Turks point to the discrepancies in how we see Christian genocides of Muslims in the Balkans and the Caucasus vs the reverse in Anatolia. For example, nobody mentions the Circassian genocide 40 years earlier, even though it occurred on a similar scale. The original version of the Treaty of Sèvres, which cut Anatolia into pieces, is a particularly sore point.

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