61–70 of 155 posts
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I saw the suggestion on twitter that the US and other countries should hand out visas to people from Hong Kong who want to live in a free country (with the hope that the US doesn't continue to decline, from that perspective).
We should go one further and carve out a territory for a New Hong Kong and let them re-build there.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
As I genuinely asked in my comment separately in the thread, what practical freedoms are being lost by the everyday person in Hong Kong that would not be considered crimes in the US (or Hong Kong prior to this), for example?
What practical freedoms are being lost by the everyday person in the US if the US decided to replace public courts with shadow puppetry? Probably none, but I would be terrified.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
They can't. For one thing they desperately need the dollars that flow through Hong Kong. The GDP size is now among the least valuable aspects of Hong Kong as it pertains to China. That has never been primary. Hong Kong is the economic staging point that much of the world uses to enter China's economy. Think of it as a translating middleman, that the world uses to convert from foreign market-based economics to China's…
They're positioning Shanghai for that. Shanghai was something like a free city until WWII. I think things escalated in Hong Kong much quicker than the CCP wanted--Shanghai isn't ready to take its place. But Shanghai is the long game, and business leaders in HK know that.
And the real losers in this fight here are Hongkongese citizens, who fought for their freedom and ultimately are losing it, on top of facing an economic crisis.
As I genuinely asked in my comment separately in the thread, what practical freedoms are being lost by the everyday person in Hong Kong that would not be considered crimes in the US (or Hong Kong prior to this), for example?
This is because systematically, over the course of hundreds of years, those in power abused those without power, over and over and over and over again, based on their own personal gain. ESPECIALLY if you don't care about the people you're in power over. This is basically why the American Revolution happened, England ran out of money fighting wars and tried to squeeze America for it. America said, no way, you don't give 2 pence about us.
Yes, your practical freedoms may not be affected in the micro timescale of the days and weeks, but over the course of centuries, countless people lose their lives and livelihoods, not their freedom, because of any number of reasons, none of them being that they did a crime to deserve it.
If history has taught us anything, you could lose your life for being:
1) A religious minority
2) A racial minority
3) A friend of someone who the person in power wants to get rid of
4) Too rich / powerful and a threat to governance
5) Well educated or with radical ideas
and much more.
You could also lose your livelihood or future by any number of means:
1) being taxed unfairly so that you make next to nothing
2) being forced to do things in a way that would benefit your mother country, at the expense of yourself
3) needing to follow laws that you have no control over that inconvenience or ruin your trade or businesses
4) needing to report to the government suspicious persons or activities
And just to be clear, I'm talking about themes from the American Revolution and escaping from the tyranny of European influence, not current affairs.
This situation is not in the same ballpark of possible outcomes as "Facebook exposing your private data to advertisers", of which only minor inconvenience is at stake. It's a lot more than that.
And the real losers in this fight here are Hongkongese citizens, who fought for their freedom and ultimately are losing it, on top of facing an economic crisis.
As I genuinely asked in my comment separately in the thread, what practical freedoms are being lost by the everyday person in Hong Kong that would not be considered crimes in the US (or Hong Kong prior to this), for example?
Here is another example: Mandatory Mandarin proficiency exams at university: https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/education/article/213041...
I have lived in HK and know many people there, and their day to day doesn't seem impacted, but culturally I suspect a massive gradual change is inevitable.
It would be like asking: does living in China differ tremendously from living in the US, for you and I? Not that much really, on a day-by-day basis!
And the real losers in this fight here are Hongkongese citizens, who fought for their freedom and ultimately are losing it, on top of facing an economic crisis.
As I genuinely asked in my comment separately in the thread, what practical freedoms are being lost by the everyday person in Hong Kong that would not be considered crimes in the US (or Hong Kong prior to this), for example?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Elsewhere I've ready that Hong Kong and Taiwan have a lot of differences like Mandarin vs Cantonese. Also Hong Kong has a much higher GDP per capita.
> like Mandarin vs Cantonese Noob question, how much do these differ? Also does it go further, perhaps a difference in culture as well as language?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
They're positioning Shanghai for that. Shanghai was something like a free city until WWII. I think things escalated in Hong Kong much quicker than the CCP wanted--Shanghai isn't ready to take its place. But Shanghai is the long game, and business leaders in HK know that.
Shanghai doesn't (and never will, at the rate things are going) have things that international companies care about like the rule of law.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, it made its own laws, had a different style of economy, had much greater freedom. From an outsider's perspective (mine), seems so.
Read up on Hong Kong history. The people of Hong Kong were under foreign rulers pretty much their entire history. This is one of the reasons why you should always fight for what’s right. Injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere. They just didn’t bother to begin fighting until they didn’t like their ruler.
But given that, what rectitude you suggest I (or they) fight for is unclear. It seems they prefer the UK legacy to the encroaching Chinese one. I'm unsure what you're saying (though I do agree with you about rights and justice, completely).
Anyone else wonder why legitimate, thoughtful responses are being downvoted?
Wumao aka the 50 Cent Party is "In Da Club."[1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/50_Cent_Party