Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy

#61

Post by ThomPete » Sun, Apr 14, 2019, 7:45 PM UTC

Nextgrid wrote: post #59

ThomPete wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But you haven't given a concrete example of you being actually affected by this so I will assume it's more an on principle argument rather than you actually pointing to any wrongdoing. Your ISP tracks you, Ycombinator tracks you, every site out there that have cookies track you. Everyone can potentially missuse that data they don't have to be Facebook for that.

Would you feel comfortable with someone following you around 24/7 and taking pictures of you? Technically this would be legal - you have no right to privacy on public property. My ISP should not be tracking me (I’m sure some of them are scummy enough to do so anyway). Ycombinator does not track me outside of their own website. Everyone does not have stupid “like” buttons scattered across the entire web for the sole p…

You dont need a like button to track someone. Of course your isp tracks you to see if you download copyrighted content. Your outrage is pretty selective all based on a non concrete potential threat which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics. Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.

Re: Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy

#62

Post by Nextgrid » Mon, Apr 15, 2019, 11:15 AM UTC

ThomPete wrote: post #61

Nextgrid wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you feel comfortable with someone following you around 24/7 and taking pictures of you? Technically this would be legal - you have no right to privacy on public property. My ISP should not be tracking me (I’m sure some of them are scummy enough to do so anyway). Ycombinator does not track me outside of their own website. Everyone does not have stupid “like” buttons scattered across the entire web for the sole p…

You dont need a like button to track someone. Of course your isp tracks you to see if you download copyrighted content. Your outrage is pretty selective all based on a non concrete potential threat which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics. Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.

My ISP does not actually track me to detect copyright infringement. Companies appointed by the right holders detect infringement by posing as other fellow pirates and waiting for your torrent client to share parts of the copyrighted content with them. They don’t track you per-se, they just use the torrent protocol how it’s supposed to be used which inherently discloses your IP address.

> which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics

I keep my Google usage to a minimum and Google Analytics is blocked by an ad-blocker on all my devices. Just because I’m talking about Facebook here doesn’t mean Google is good. All non-opt-in tracking needs to die. If tracking is so good and harmless then surely making it opt-in wouldn’t make a difference as everyone would opt-in anyway, right?

> ycombinator

YC’s business model is not cancerous and does not involve tracking people, so even if they have the possibility to do so (although their tracking would be nowhere near what FB does) I trust them not to do it just because they don’t need to.

> Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.

Not really misuse (the system worked exactly as designed), but here’s an example of how tracking can backfire: https://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2012/02/16/how-targ...

Also, do we have to wait for misuse to happen before taking steps to prevent it? We know it’s possible and such a goldmine of data can be very damaging if misused, so why wait for it to actually be misused? Let’s take action now and make sure it can’t be misused in the future.

Re: Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy

#63

Post by ThomPete » Mon, Apr 15, 2019, 3:23 PM UTC

Nextgrid wrote: post #62

ThomPete wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You dont need a like button to track someone. Of course your isp tracks you to see if you download copyrighted content. Your outrage is pretty selective all based on a non concrete potential threat which exist with everything from google to your phone to ycombinator to google analytics. Give me a concrete missuse, not just specualtions based on selctively who you like or dont.

My ISP does not actually track me to detect copyright infringement. Companies appointed by the right holders detect infringement by posing as other fellow pirates and waiting for your torrent client to share parts of the copyrighted content with them. They don’t track you per-se, they just use the torrent protocol how it’s supposed to be used which inherently discloses your IP address. > which exist with everything f…

Again you keep giving examples of potential misuse you don't provide any concrete examples.

That's like asking me to support a fight against cars because they can be used to run over people potentially.

I have no problem with you not using FB and trying to stay as anonymous as possible, but if you want to use the internet and it's many services I just not sure why I should support you when you want to take action against services I like to use.

Re: Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy

#64

Post by Nextgrid » Mon, Apr 15, 2019, 3:54 PM UTC

ThomPete wrote: post #63

Nextgrid wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My ISP does not actually track me to detect copyright infringement. Companies appointed by the right holders detect infringement by posing as other fellow pirates and waiting for your torrent client to share parts of the copyrighted content with them. They don’t track you per-se, they just use the torrent protocol how it’s supposed to be used which inherently discloses your IP address. > which exist with everything f…

Again you keep giving examples of potential misuse you don't provide any concrete examples. That's like asking me to support a fight against cars because they can be used to run over people potentially. I have no problem with you not using FB and trying to stay as anonymous as possible, but if you want to use the internet and it's many services I just not sure why I should support you when you want to take action aga…

Okay, here's an example of misuse: https://gawker.com/5637234/gcreep-google-engineer-stalked-te...

The same thing can happen with the data being collected by the various advertising trackers. It's even worse because unlike text messages, you don't even know what kind of data the trackers are silently collecting.

> but if you want to use the internet and it's many services I just not sure why I should support you when you want to take action against services I like to use.

I don't have a problem with you using those services. All I want is for those services to respect people's privacy and make tracking opt-in, so people like you can continue to use them, while people like me no longer have to worry about being stalked.

Re: Facebook Is Stealing Your Family’s Joy

#65

Post by ThomPete » Mon, Apr 15, 2019, 5:41 PM UTC

Nextgrid wrote: post #64

ThomPete wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again you keep giving examples of potential misuse you don't provide any concrete examples. That's like asking me to support a fight against cars because they can be used to run over people potentially. I have no problem with you not using FB and trying to stay as anonymous as possible, but if you want to use the internet and it's many services I just not sure why I should support you when you want to take action aga…

Okay, here's an example of misuse: https://gawker.com/5637234/gcreep-google-engineer-stalked-te... The same thing can happen with the data being collected by the various advertising trackers. It's even worse because unlike text messages, you don't even know what kind of data the trackers are silently collecting. > but if you want to use the internet and it's many services I just not sure why I should support you when…

But as far as you have shown so far, they are respecting it.