Request: Firefox extension that works like AdBlock but for Brexit related news
Not opening the link and commenting will help somewhat.
Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
61–70 of 1001 posts
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
Just to be clear, article 50 hasn't been revoked, the UK will still leave the EU with no deal on March 30th. This vote is very damaging to the government's position, but as it stands there's been no move, assurance, or guarantees, to stop article 50. If article 50 is activated it starts a two year countdown as the UK slowly moves out of the EU. Even if the government loses the no confidence vote, there's still no imp…
> Just to be clear, article 50 hasn't been revoked, the UK will still leave the EU with no deal on March 30th. I don't feel you clarified anything. Do you mean if article 50 isn't revoked that the UK will leave the EU (true if nothing else happens) or that there are no circumstances under which the UK can remain in the EU?
The House of Commons need to vote to rescind Article 50 before March 30th otherwise the UK will automatically leave the EU with no deal.
There's currently no legislation, implied legislation, promises, or assurances from either the government or opposition to do so.
Essentially until Article 50 is withdrawn, the UK continues to march forward towards hard Brexit.
A successful vote today on Theresa May's deal would have assured a hard Brexit. The vote failing however hasn't resulted in "remain," it has simply placed the UK into an unknown state with automatic hard Brexit still lurking on the horizon.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#63To be honest this is just a repeat of two years ago, apart from now it's May not getting her way instead of Cameron. The whole thing is such a colossal failure that they need to just to give up and stop acting like this is the 'will of the people' - as if people don't change their mind when presented with the facts or something.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#64Earlier quoted context omitted.
What I don't understand (and I am very ignorant!) is why the initial vote can't just be looked at as a stage in the decision process. Time has gone on, and the public has become more educated as to what the true effects of Brexit will be. Even leaving aside the question of how dishonest the pro-Brexit arguments were. It just seems reasonable to have another vote.
Because this would imply a public referendum is impotent - if you don't like the outcome, you can just keep campaigning and try again later.
> if you don't like the outcome, you can just keep campaigning and try again later.
Quite honestly, there is nothing stopping you from doing this anyways. This is the point of democracy. Nothing is ever final.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#65Imagine if all the great minds thinking, discussing, reporting and debating brexit spent their time on solving real problems facing the human race instead.
Because democracy, whilst not perfect, is the best system we have for civilisation to continue. As someone who voted remain, I have to say that we now have to leave the EU. If Brexit was to be stopped by Parliment, the damage to UK politics would last a generation. People would simply loose faith in the system, giving rise to more extreme political parties - and we all know where that leads to. If I was in charge, I'…
Referendums are not democratic they are a tool employed by an incumbent to back up a position.
Democracy generally requires voting for representatives that serve your best interests on issues that matter to you. It’s not about choosing between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#66Imagine if all the great minds thinking, discussing, reporting and debating brexit spent their time on solving real problems facing the human race instead.
Brexit is a real problem that the human race is faced with. There can be no higher question than that of what rules people should be using to deal with each other. For most of human history the rules were imposed by force. You open your market because if you don't, I'll escalate from sending a strongly worded missive all the way up to sending my armies to pillage your countryside. Recently we've moved to a more contr…
> The EU is a phenomenally novel way of integrating sovereign nation-states into a singular political entity, that happened without war.
Not just without war, but between nations that've been regularly at war with each other (in various iterations) for well over a thousand years.
It's a pretty remarkable achievement.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#67What I find curious through this whole affair is the silence on the topic by the U.S. For two countries that share a "Special Relationship" I had expected to hear the State Dept. say something. After all, major changes in governance by a close ally is bound to have secondary effects. And, please don't tell me that the Special Relationship is just a put-on show. It is set in numerous treaties between the U.S. and U.K. for centuries. There have been no announcements of rescinding any of those well-hidden treaties. Also consider that the U.S. has three of the most sophisticated econometric models of all other countries, probably better than the U.K.'s.
That leads me to believe this is a fait accompli and the U.S. may have actually suggested the referrendum as the best way forward. The brute fact is the the U.S. is going through it's own Brexit from earlier trade relationships that were set many years ago and which could be improved upon. You think I'm harbouring a conspiracy theory? Who told you that?
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#68Earlier quoted context omitted.
What I don't understand (and I am very ignorant!) is why the initial vote can't just be looked at as a stage in the decision process. Time has gone on, and the public has become more educated as to what the true effects of Brexit will be. Even leaving aside the question of how dishonest the pro-Brexit arguments were. It just seems reasonable to have another vote.
And then, if this second voting yields a different result, shouldn't they hold a third referendum afterwards? And maybe a few more, as you can always say the last one was not the genuine one.
Replace "should" with "could" and you'd be right. Each vote would be genuine if its conudcted according to law.
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#69Ahhhh fudge ...
People’s vote ... it might just happen.
May now has to chat with the opposition, understand what it’d take to vote yes , take that to Europe, bring back a compromise ... vote again, get that accepted.
People’s vote is starting to look like the more likely outcome... had she lost by say 50 or 100 votes ... ok but 432 vs 202 ?! 230 votes to claw back somehow .
Re: Brexit Deal Fails in Parliament
#70 All I can think of is, why? I don't know what were the main points against the deal, but the only reason I can think of that the deal is rejected is that Corbin, or whoever else would come out of this kerfuffle victorious, wants to re-issue vote on leaving the EU in order to stay..?
This is insanely puzzling to me, and very much unexpected. Can someone ELI5..? Or maybe ELI15 would be enough.