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Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

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Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#61

Post by deepnotderp »

liftbigweights wrote: post #36
nullbyte wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not orders of magnitude stronger. But I agree, it's be interesting to see Alpha's analysis.

In a 100 game matchup, AlphaZero had 28 wins 72 draws and 0 losses. I'd classify that as orders of magnitude better. https://www.chess.com/news/view/google-s-alphazero-destroys-... But yeah, it would be interesting to see a side by side comparison of alphazero and stockfish's live analysis of these games.

Stockfish was severely crippled in that comparison, Stockfish had no opening book and only like a gig of RAM, as well as a very weak CPU and also it had a fixed amount of time per move, even though variable "thinking" compute time is a major advantage for stockfish

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#62

Post by 6nf »

nurettin wrote: post #33
liftbigweights wrote: post #27

Considering AlphaZero was orders of magnitude stronger than stock fish, it would be interesting to see AlphaZero's analysis if it was available. Edit: Alphazero's record against Stock Fish is 28 wins, 72 ties and 0 losses. In a 100 game matchup, AlphaZero had 28 wins 72 draws and 0 losses. I'd classify that as orders of magnitude better. https://www.chess.com/news/view/google-s-alphazero-destroys-...

According to the ChessNetwork yt channel, Alpha zero does not consistently beat stockfish. But when it does, it does so in a very interesting manner.

AlphaZero draws a lot against Stockfish but Stockfish won ZERO games in their 100 game match up.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#63

Post by narag »

EGreg wrote: post #8
curiousgal wrote: post #3

Magnus Carlsen with a rating of 2835 is playing against Fabiano Caruana with a rating of 2832. This is their 7th game. They tied for all the previous 6.

Wow I can’t believe these guys are now the guys playing for the world championship. I remember playing Fabiano in the local chess park when he was like 14 :) They’ve come a long way indeed!

Did you win any game?

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#64

Post by [deleted] »

dgut wrote: post #55
walrus01 wrote: post #28

Dumb chess question from a person that's never competed, why are international chess rankings divided by Male or Female? There are even olympic sports now that are mixed-gender such as Curling.

Chess, besides its usual characteristics it's known for, is an attack and dominance game. Women will naturally be less interested/good at that. The championships aren't male only (although there are female only championships).

[deleted]

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#65

Post by iainmerrick »

yesenadam wrote: post #54
fwn wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's interesting. Do you have a source for that? I always believed it is because either FIDE ratings are only updated once a month (see 7.1[1]) or because their ELO is too close, therefore the prob. of winning is 0.5 for both anyways. [1] http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=172&view=article

That's not true about Elo being updated particularly at the end of tournaments - either official/FIDE ratings or live ratings. I heard (possibly from the Chess24 commentators) that if their difference in rating was 4 or more, each draw would bring them closer together in live rating - Magnus would lose rating with each draw; but as it's 3, their ratings don't change. i.e. anacleto was right, thomasahle wrong. Also, E…

Could it just be that the most recent comments were listed first? I think HN does that to give them a chance to get read and voted on.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#66

Post by tzs »

thomasahle wrote: post #35
anacleto wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The curious thing is that Carlsen’s ELO didnt’t get nibbled even after all theese consequent draws. They’re too close.

That's because ELO only gets updated at the end of a tournament, not every game.

FIDE also calculates a game-by-game "live" rating. It's not normally published but it is used for some title requirements.

For example the requirements for the most common way to earn the GM title include a requirement that your rating has reached 2500. The live rating is used for that.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#67

Post by russellbeattie »

foobaw wrote: post #6

Another nail-biting draw!

It's hard to change a game that's so old, but draws shouldn't be allowed, only stalemates.

Imagine if the Lakers played the Warriors, and late in the 4th quarter, the game is tied, and LeBron and Curry decide they are tired, declare a draw and go to their locker rooms. Not particularly satisfying.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#68

Post by bonzini »

liftbigweights wrote: post #36
nullbyte wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not orders of magnitude stronger. But I agree, it's be interesting to see Alpha's analysis.

In a 100 game matchup, AlphaZero had 28 wins 72 draws and 0 losses. I'd classify that as orders of magnitude better. https://www.chess.com/news/view/google-s-alphazero-destroys-... But yeah, it would be interesting to see a side by side comparison of alphazero and stockfish's live analysis of these games.

White was winning twice as many points as black (64 points for white, 36 for black; draws give 0.5 points to both players) and points difference is all that matters for Elo. As a matter of fact, 64-36 is pretty much exactly what you'd expect when two players have 100 Elo difference.

Your incorrect perception comes from the fact that, at very high levels (as shown by this match as well), draws become way more common than for lower levels. A 3400 vs 3300 Elo match might be 28-72-0, a 1400 vs 1300 match might be 60-8-32. At the lower level, you see one player winning twice as many games as the other, at the higher level you see one player losing all the time; that looks different to you, but as far as Elo difference is concerned the two results are exactly the same.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#69

Post by taneq »

dgut wrote: post #55
walrus01 wrote: post #28

Dumb chess question from a person that's never competed, why are international chess rankings divided by Male or Female? There are even olympic sports now that are mixed-gender such as Curling.

Chess, besides its usual characteristics it's known for, is an attack and dominance game. Women will naturally be less interested/good at that. The championships aren't male only (although there are female only championships).

Women aren't naturally less interested in or good at chess. There must be some other explanation for the top 90 chess players all being male.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#70

Post by steve_musk »

taneq wrote: post #69
dgut wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chess, besides its usual characteristics it's known for, is an attack and dominance game. Women will naturally be less interested/good at that. The championships aren't male only (although there are female only championships).

Women aren't naturally less interested in or good at chess. There must be some other explanation for the top 90 chess players all being male.

What evidence is there that this is true?
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