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Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

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Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#51

Post by TwoBit »

liftbigweights wrote: post #36
nullbyte wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not orders of magnitude stronger. But I agree, it's be interesting to see Alpha's analysis.

In a 100 game matchup, AlphaZero had 28 wins 72 draws and 0 losses. I'd classify that as orders of magnitude better. https://www.chess.com/news/view/google-s-alphazero-destroys-... But yeah, it would be interesting to see a side by side comparison of alphazero and stockfish's live analysis of these games.

Wasn't Stockfish crippled in that set of games? Such as no opening book, which would give a computer like AlphaZero an initial advantage? And a relatively weak CPU setup, compared to the massive computer AlphaZero used?

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#52

Post by Tervis »

fermienrico wrote: post #23

On a side note: I think Pentagram did an amazing job with the WCC branding [1] in 2014. It's ridiculously non-conventional for a serious organization such as FIDE to adopt it. They did reject the proposal for Shuka Design for the new "pawnographic" (as it was hastagged on twitter) logo [2] for the 2018 championship and only kept the arms tangled up around a chess board. Still, its extraordinary and personally I love…

I think the official logo has some Chilly Gonzales Ivory Tower vibes.

Edit: The album art: https://www.chillygonzales.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/GE...

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#53

Post by yesenadam »

curiousgal wrote: post #3

Magnus Carlsen with a rating of 2835 is playing against Fabiano Caruana with a rating of 2832. This is their 7th game. They tied for all the previous 6.

They're called draws. The match will be tied if it's 6-6 after 12 games, then they'll go to tiebreaks - 4 rapid games, then if still no winner, up to 5 mini-matches of 2 blitz games, then ultimately an Armageddon game if needed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Chess_Championship_2018#...

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#54

Post by yesenadam »

fwn wrote: post #43
thomasahle wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's because ELO only gets updated at the end of a tournament, not every game.

That's interesting. Do you have a source for that? I always believed it is because either FIDE ratings are only updated once a month (see 7.1[1]) or because their ELO is too close, therefore the prob. of winning is 0.5 for both anyways. [1] http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=172&view=article

That's not true about Elo being updated particularly at the end of tournaments - either official/FIDE ratings or live ratings.

I heard (possibly from the Chess24 commentators) that if their difference in rating was 4 or more, each draw would bring them closer together in live rating - Magnus would lose rating with each draw; but as it's 3, their ratings don't change. i.e. anacleto was right, thomasahle wrong.

Also, Elo isn't an acronym (ELO) as one might think - it's named after its inventor Arpad Elo. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elo_rating_system

Interestingly, when I first looked at this page, most of the good/correct comments were voted down, most of the bad ones not, it was weird. (It made me suspect that other HN pages are like that but I don't know it! - I know chess better than most subjects discussed on here) But that has now almost totally been corrected.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#55

Post by dgut »

walrus01 wrote: post #28

Dumb chess question from a person that's never competed, why are international chess rankings divided by Male or Female? There are even olympic sports now that are mixed-gender such as Curling.

Chess, besides its usual characteristics it's known for, is an attack and dominance game. Women will naturally be less interested/good at that. The championships aren't male only (although there are female only championships).

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#56

Post by [deleted] »

yesenadam wrote: post #54
fwn wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's interesting. Do you have a source for that? I always believed it is because either FIDE ratings are only updated once a month (see 7.1[1]) or because their ELO is too close, therefore the prob. of winning is 0.5 for both anyways. [1] http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=172&view=article

That's not true about Elo being updated particularly at the end of tournaments - either official/FIDE ratings or live ratings. I heard (possibly from the Chess24 commentators) that if their difference in rating was 4 or more, each draw would bring them closer together in live rating - Magnus would lose rating with each draw; but as it's 3, their ratings don't change. i.e. anacleto was right, thomasahle wrong. Also, E…

[deleted]

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#57

Post by ammon »

antaviana wrote: post #44
thomasahle wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AlphaZero was playing Stockfish 8. This is done using Stockfish dev which is more than 110 ELO higher than Stockfish 8 (see https://github.com/glinscott/fishtest/wiki/Regression-Tests ) and higher than what was reported for AlphaZero. Check out the Leela project, which is trying to reproduce and improve the AlphaZero project to also beat Stockfish dev: http://lczero.org/ (at this point they are about equal with Stock…

A 100 ELO difference is about a player twice as stronger. With a 100 ELO difference, Stockfish would have won some games. 28Win 72Draw and O Loss in my opinion reflects at least 300 ELO (8 times stronger).

Elo is not a matter of opinion. There's a formula for it, and 28 wins, 72 draws and 0 losses represents almost exactly a 100 point Elo difference.

https://www.3dkingdoms.com/chess/elo.htm

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#58

Post by [deleted] »

yesenadam wrote: post #54
fwn wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's interesting. Do you have a source for that? I always believed it is because either FIDE ratings are only updated once a month (see 7.1[1]) or because their ELO is too close, therefore the prob. of winning is 0.5 for both anyways. [1] http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=172&view=article

That's not true about Elo being updated particularly at the end of tournaments - either official/FIDE ratings or live ratings. I heard (possibly from the Chess24 commentators) that if their difference in rating was 4 or more, each draw would bring them closer together in live rating - Magnus would lose rating with each draw; but as it's 3, their ratings don't change. i.e. anacleto was right, thomasahle wrong. Also, E…

[deleted]

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#59

Post by xb100s »

fermienrico wrote: post #23

On a side note: I think Pentagram did an amazing job with the WCC branding [1] in 2014. It's ridiculously non-conventional for a serious organization such as FIDE to adopt it. They did reject the proposal for Shuka Design for the new "pawnographic" (as it was hastagged on twitter) logo [2] for the 2018 championship and only kept the arms tangled up around a chess board. Still, its extraordinary and personally I love…

I think they are all horrible, especially the #pawnographic one.

Ironically, when I first saw these logos, I thought "appropriate for a perfume at best". There you go.

Re: Chess World Championship: Stockfish live-analyzing game 7

#60

Post by mccensor »

fermienrico wrote: post #23

On a side note: I think Pentagram did an amazing job with the WCC branding [1] in 2014. It's ridiculously non-conventional for a serious organization such as FIDE to adopt it. They did reject the proposal for Shuka Design for the new "pawnographic" (as it was hastagged on twitter) logo [2] for the 2018 championship and only kept the arms tangled up around a chess board. Still, its extraordinary and personally I love…

I find them all horrible, especially the #pawnographic one.

When I saw them at first, I thought "appropriate for a perfume at best". There you go.

[This whole comment section is not at all on a high level compared to other chess resources. But by all means, delete dissenting opinions. Why is the Pentagram thing the top comment anyway? Product placement?]

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