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An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

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Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#61

Post by hueving »

WkndTriathlete wrote: post #14
alistairSH wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. Except for the VERY long-legged, a reclined seat-back in front doesn't remove leg space. It pivots at/above knee level and simply pivots marginally closer to me. I have never had a reclined seat obstruct my view of the entertainment screen or make me tray unusable. On the other side, I don't recline the seat to create more space for myself. I recline it to alleviate discomfort from the absurdly upright defaul…

What? The seat pivots below knee level by definition, unless you've found a plane where the base of the seat slopes down from the back to the front. (Since the seat is level or slopes slightly upward from back to front then the pivot point is at the back of the base of the seat. Since the legs are sitting on - i.e. above - the seat, then the knees have to be above the pivot point and reclining does indeed remove leg…

Not by definition. Most people don't sit precisely with a 90 degree angle and instead extend their legs into the space under the seat in front of them.

If your bag is taking up all of that space, you are doing it wrong.

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#62

Post by hueving »

fivestar wrote: post #44
supergeek133 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depending on the airplane/seat, it actually makes my legs have a tighter fit. I'm 6'2". Whenever I fly for work I usually pay the extra money for a better seat personally. I typically don't recline my seat on a plane, because in most cases it makes my ride less comfortable to be behind someone who reclines.

That's just the thing "pay the extra money"--okay, fine, but we are doing this all time just to get back to where we were a few years ago minus the "pay the extra money" part of the equation. It's not just airlines that are screwing us, but grocery chains come quickly to mind, and basically any place where the runaway inflation is being passed on to us all the while everyone thinks this is "normal" and "fine" and all…

Cut the entitlement lines. "previous generations" mostly couldn't afford to fly at all because it was so expensive relative to normal incomes. Today people can afford to fly on very low incomes in these economy seats you're getting flustered about.

Here's a hint, pay for first class. That's the equivalent level of service and price range that previous generations received (inflation adjusted).

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#63

Post by e2e4 »

I think this problem has been at least partially solved with the slide forward to recline seats; e.g.:

"One product from Zodiac is the 5751 slimline economy class seat. This particular model of seat uses a unique recline mechanism where the seat bucket moves forward while reclining."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zodiac_Seats_U.S.

here is an example of the seat: http://downloads.cathaypacific.com/cx/new_seat/seatguide/Oly...

p.s. on international 8+ hours flights resting/sleeping without reclining is challenging ...

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#64

Post by Markoff »

sanswork wrote: post #52
Markoff wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no, you buy seat with space for your legs, if someone is taking my space for legs he is taking something I paid for they paid for space in front of their seat up to back of the seat in front of them

They paid for the space taken up when the seat reclined if your legs don't fit in that space they you need to buy another seat or pressure airlines to start better serving people of your size. It's not the person in front of you who is at fault it is everyone that has ever done a ticket search and sorted from lowest price to highest.

i am no special person, i am pretty skinny so they have low fuel expenses on me compared to some short fat people and i have no problem to travel with reasonable polite people who won't recline seat for someone much taller seeing behind them

but ok, let's stop being polite and charge people per kg of weight if we do this already with baggage, at least fat people will have motivation to stop eating, not sure what unhealthy i did that i grew tall and should handle ignorant people reclining seats

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#66

Post by Markoff »

cbanek wrote: post #24
tutufan wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Flying in a reclined seat is pure torture to me.

What if we grouped the plane into two sections: those who want to recline, and those who do not? If you're a recliner behind a recliner, happy. If you're a non-recliner behind a non-recliner, happy. Split on the exit row, or hopefully at least one row of people who don't care.

i think you would hardly find tecliners if it means someone in front of them will recline too, these are selfish people who want space for their legs plus take space behind them, once their own space would be at risk they would very quickly stop reclining

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#67

Post by Markoff »

mrep wrote: post #56
UnoriginalGuy wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I never had problems about knees getting closer or not But other people do, that's the point. I'm only 6'1 but with long legs, if someone reclines in front they're literally on top of my knees the entire flight. When turbulence occurs they bounce up and down on my knees. I try to book exit rows and Economy+ when budget allows, but for all other times I take painkillers and just have to let my knees get damaged by t…

So should the smallest/cheapest seat be designed for shaq to sit in it? Why should smaller people be forced to pay for bigger seats that they do not need?

the seats are fine, reclining is not and should be removed completely

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#68

Post by Markoff »

WkndTriathlete wrote: post #14
alistairSH wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. Except for the VERY long-legged, a reclined seat-back in front doesn't remove leg space. It pivots at/above knee level and simply pivots marginally closer to me. I have never had a reclined seat obstruct my view of the entertainment screen or make me tray unusable. On the other side, I don't recline the seat to create more space for myself. I recline it to alleviate discomfort from the absurdly upright defaul…

What? The seat pivots below knee level by definition, unless you've found a plane where the base of the seat slopes down from the back to the front. (Since the seat is level or slopes slightly upward from back to front then the pivot point is at the back of the base of the seat. Since the legs are sitting on - i.e. above - the seat, then the knees have to be above the pivot point and reclining does indeed remove leg…

and the funny part is someone shorter but heavier than you pay same price as you though economically he cost airline in fuel more than you, so if we wanna be fair we should be charged per kilo of live with, same as with baggage, i am fine with smaller and lighter people paying less than me, i am not fine with someone voluntarily living unhealthy and reclining seat paying same as me

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#69

Post by supergeek133 »

hueving wrote: post #58
supergeek133 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Numerous times over the past two years as I've traveled more for work I've had to out loud say the phrase: "We're all in this together".

Who did you say that to? If it was to the person in front of you, you're being an asshole. Just recline your seat or deal with the reduced space in front of you. If you want more room between you and the seat in front of you, pay for it. Don't try to guilt the person in front of you to make their own flight uncomfortable for sleeping to please you. That's selfish.

Take it easy.

I've said that to numerous people. I never say that to people in front of me who recline. I deal with it like everyone else does.

The most recent time was during one of the computer outages, someone tried to cut in front of everyone to check a bag. I just calmly said that we're all in this delay together, we all have places to be, and it's nobody's fault at this counter. So just wait like the rest of us.

I actually don't get into conflicts with air travel, but for some reason it triggers others instantly.

Re: An investigation into the economics of airplane seat reclining

#70

Post by freehunter »

sanswork wrote: post #30
freehunter wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anything on the tray table is the problem. Reclining reduces my use of my tray table. It also reduces the area I have to read my book, I can't hold it as far from my face as I like. But IMO it should be enough that it intrudes into my space, which is already at an extreme premium. It doesn't have to be useful space, I'm already cramped and you're making my space smaller. Please don't.

The space the seat reclines into isn't your space.

I disagree. I could reach into that space when I sat down and now I can't.

Think of it this way: my house has 8 foot ceilings. I'm only 6 foot tall, so I could lower my ceilings by almost two feet and not hit my head. But it would certainly impact my comfort level inside my house.

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