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Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

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Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#61

Post by dvt »

michaelt wrote: post #49
dvt wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why are we so fond of these narratives? Because some people believe in that kind of remedy for these problems. I'm being a bit reductive, but there are basically two ways of solving social problems like homelessness: (a) everyone is forced to chip in (e.g. taxes) or (b) citizens make society better by their own volition (e.g. donations, volunteering). I see the merit of (a), but I like the idea of (b) a lot more.

I like the idea of (b) a lot more. It's a nice idea - but anyone who believes citizens should be making such donations is surely already making them - and yet our problems still exist. Doesn't that rather imply the average person isn't as charitable as would be needed?

> Doesn't that rather imply the average person isn't as charitable as would be needed?

Yep, I think it does :( So (a) might be a better pragmatic solution.

Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#62

Post by alkonaut »

dvt wrote: post #60
alkonaut wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If someone drove around in a van and offered conversation to homeless people with a christian angle - that would be great. It's also great if someone offers laundry service. Talking to people is great. Talking about religion must be on their terms, otherwise it's preaching or being a missionary - which isn't. What disturbs me is the idea of people have to feel even a little pressure to participate in his prayers or r…

> If you are serious about charity then don't preach. Even if being charitable is part of acting out your own faith, separate the two. I don't really follow. If they are being charitable because of their faith, why separate the two? It's an integral part of their identity and why they do what they do.

> I don't really follow. If they are being charitable because of their faith, why separate the two?

Let me rephrase it: if being a christian requires you to be a good samaritan - by all means be a good samaritan. Charity is a good thing. But if you want to come across as doing someone a favor altruistically - don't preach.

Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#63

Post by dvt »

alkonaut wrote: post #62
dvt wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you are serious about charity then don't preach. Even if being charitable is part of acting out your own faith, separate the two. I don't really follow. If they are being charitable because of their faith, why separate the two? It's an integral part of their identity and why they do what they do.

> I don't really follow. If they are being charitable because of their faith, why separate the two? Let me rephrase it: if being a christian requires you to be a good samaritan - by all means be a good samaritan. Charity is a good thing. But if you want to come across as doing someone a favor altruistically - don't preach.

Let me offer a thought experiment. You're moving and need some help. Some dude on the street freely offers to help you and carries much of your stuff. What a nice guy. Once all is well and done and you're moved into your new place, he turns towards you and says "hey by the way, you seem like a nice guy and I'm a part of the local chess club, we're always looking for new members -- care to hear more?"

I just don't see how his invitation to join the chess club detracts from his good deed. Even if (for whatever reason) he helps people move solely to get a chance to ask them to join chess club, I still have a hard time finding fault.

Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#64

Post by ferentchak »

etjossem wrote: post #45
golergka wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's kind of ironic that you mention how his charity isn't 100% altruistic, but then juxtapose it with "social safety nets" - by which, I assume, you mean tax-funded welfare, which is forced on people by government and has nothing altruistic about it on any level.

Actual altruism is very rare. The level at which it exists in the United States is nowhere near sufficient to solve this country's homelessness problem. By all means, write inspiring news stories about pure generosity when it appears, but this is not one of those times. This is a man who looks at our collective unwillingness to help our most needy and sees a religious opportunity. Some voters support safety nets out…

If you see it from his perspective it is as altruistic an action as is possible for a person to take.

He is providing a services to help people in some day to day way. While he is providing that kindness he is taking the time to save them from being tortured by fire monsters forever. Also a very altruistic action, if he is right about the fire monsters that action is really about the only altruistic action that is not trivial and temporary.

Perspective is important, if he was poking their eyes out to save them from fire monsters that's one thing but feeding people and making sure they are safe and happy seems pretty legit to me

Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#65

Post by everybodyknows »

etjossem wrote: post #38

Acts of charity like this have always struck me as creating an uncomfortable power dynamic. When sticking around to hear a religious presentation is the price of admission, it's not a pure form of generosity; it's transactional. Ron Powers even mentions the captive audience situation outright, near the end of the video. "If you have something like their clothes, you've got them for an hour, two hours ... we might as…

From the video and article alone, it's hard to gauge the degree of coercion involved -- by 'them' he seems to mean the clothes. Wonder how he reacts to homeless who interrupt his sermon with "There's something I need to do now, back in an hour"?

Re: Engineer Converts Van into Laundromat, Offers Free Loads to Homeless

#66

Post by everybodyknows »

izak30 wrote: post #30
jdavis703 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is anybody doing anything similar in the SF Bay Area?

Check out Lavamae. While you're there send them some money. http://lavamae.org/

No financial info apparent on the site, and the FAQ is a link to PDF -- yields "Decompression error" on Android. I'd be wary.
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