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Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

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Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#61

Having volunteered with Gaza Sky Geeks (GSG) and been on the ground all I can say is that this is a big positive in the region and for the people living in Gaza. You would not believe how welcoming and hard working Palestinians are. There is a generalization because of the conflict but at the end of the day these are people like you and me trying to achieve their goals in a positive way. There is a political situatio…

I'm also a volunteer mentor - at the hackathon I was at, they achieved 83% female participation! Everyone was so fun and welcoming, as it say. They continue to inspire me.

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#62

Having volunteered with Gaza Sky Geeks (GSG) and been on the ground all I can say is that this is a big positive in the region and for the people living in Gaza. You would not believe how welcoming and hard working Palestinians are. There is a generalization because of the conflict but at the end of the day these are people like you and me trying to achieve their goals in a positive way. There is a political situatio…

As a network engineer I am immensely curious what the internet in Gaza looks like at OSI layers 1-3: what are the upstream routes in and out, who are the commercial ISPs, what IP space do they have, what are their BGP adjacencies, etc?

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#63
post #35
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not in the slightest. This kind of activity (economic activity) is probably the best way possible to deescalate the conflict. Israel has no interest in Gaza, they just want them to stop trying to attack, so if anything this program is for Israel, not against it. If you need evidence for that, then note that even during the worst conflicts Israel kept full communication (Cell and Internet) active in Gaza, which is opp…

> Israel has no interest in Gaza, they just want them to stop trying to attack This is false and one-sided. Likud, the ruling party in Israel, has in its platform an explicit denial of the right for a Palestinian state to exist west of the Jordan river.[1] Everything you've heard about Palestinians/Hamas denying Israel the right to exist is actually true about Israel as well towards Palestine. (In fact Hamas has stat…

> In fact Hamas has stated they would respect a two-state solution

Sure, but will they agree to actual terms? Terms that Israel won't instantly reject?

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#64
post #50
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have a solution. There's plenty of trauma on both sides. I don't want to start dredging up all the horrible acts of violence experienced by Israelis. This sort of thinking is not productive. It's more useful to think given where we are right now what can be done... Part of the issue with rebuilding is that the raw materials get confiscated to support the war effort. The bombing is at least partly related to t…

It is indeed not black and white. But when you are surrounded on all sides by a wall, when living conditions never improve, when hospitals lack even the most basic equipment, and when there is no improvement in sight, doesn't armed resistance make sense? Hamas sometimes takes it a bit too far, I'll definitely admit that, but I think resistance is a valid approach to their conundrum. When you are outgunned and outnumb…

> doesn't armed resistance make sense

Not when stopping likely means your enemy is willing to help.

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#65
I volunteered for them back in May of 2016 and wrote about it here on HN. Can't say enough good things about the experience and the people.

Please help their cause. I can personally vouch that the money will go to good people who are hungry to learn and eager to make a difference. I ran two workshops when I went and we had great turnout in each session. People were asking great questions and wanted to stay after to continue learning.

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#66
post #54
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I know, the walls came up as security measures because of the second Intifada. Before that, people lived in Gaza and worked in Israel and people travelled between for shopping, etc. (This isolation gave serious economic problems in Israel too.) So the isolation and security came up because of violence, the terror against civilian Israelis is not an original reaction to the wall. But I suspect you know this.

So when a population misbehaves, you setup a ghetto to isolate it? We're talking about upwards of a million people here by the way. Is that really the right way to handle things? Looking at the whole picture, I maintain that resistance is justified.

When they are actively trying to murder people, yes. It's not right, but neither is sending in suicide bombers.

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#67

Having volunteered with Gaza Sky Geeks (GSG) and been on the ground all I can say is that this is a big positive in the region and for the people living in Gaza. You would not believe how welcoming and hard working Palestinians are. There is a generalization because of the conflict but at the end of the day these are people like you and me trying to achieve their goals in a positive way. There is a political situatio…

As a network engineer I am immensely curious what the internet in Gaza looks like at OSI layers 1-3: what are the upstream routes in and out, who are the commercial ISPs, what IP space do they have, what are their BGP adjacencies, etc?

Not that this answers your question but it might shed some light: when I went last year, I ran tracert to google.com. The only interesting thing I remember is everything went through the West Bank.

Great question though - I'm curious too.

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#68
post #20

is doing something like this considered a political statement against israel?

As an Israeli, I find it extremely frustrating that I can't help. I joined their "supporters" group and wanted to Mentor but it didn't really work out. I totally get why they weren't really interested - but it's frustrating. Most Israelis think this is a great opportunity and support these sort of initiatives. They've worked well with Jordan in the past.

[deleted]

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#69
post #50
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have a solution. There's plenty of trauma on both sides. I don't want to start dredging up all the horrible acts of violence experienced by Israelis. This sort of thinking is not productive. It's more useful to think given where we are right now what can be done... Part of the issue with rebuilding is that the raw materials get confiscated to support the war effort. The bombing is at least partly related to t…

It is indeed not black and white. But when you are surrounded on all sides by a wall, when living conditions never improve, when hospitals lack even the most basic equipment, and when there is no improvement in sight, doesn't armed resistance make sense? Hamas sometimes takes it a bit too far, I'll definitely admit that, but I think resistance is a valid approach to their conundrum. When you are outgunned and outnumb…

Don't take it personally but it sounds you're not really familiar with the details and the history of the conflict.

Gaza is not surrounded on all sides by a wall. They have a long border with Egypt that's been relatively porous until fairly recently when Egypt has begun to construct obstacles, they have the sea (under naval blockade but they're allowed to fish) and even the border with Israel is not 100% walled. You might be confusing Gaza with the wall that was erected between Israel and parts of the West Bank. It's true they are isolated which again is what happens when you piss off your neighbors. There are border crossings and people and goods do cross.

Their living conditions do improve, but slowly, and tend to regress when a conflict flares out. Again, partly by their choice of what to invest in.

Resistance is the cause of their (well Hamas or a portion thereof) conundrum and it's going to get them nowhere. What are they resisting? They're resisting the existence of the state of Israel.

As long as they continue "resisting" in the form of tunneling under the border, investing all their resources in arming themselves to the teeth, building and using an arsenal of rockets, supporting the ISIS contingency in Sinai, indiscriminately attacking civilians, inciting hate and racism, etc. they are going to find themselves in a bad spot. The answer to your question for most people is yes, if you're outgunned and outnumbered by many of orders of magnitude you "give up" or at least try and avoid outright war. They could get an agreement tomorrow if all they cared about was living peacefully in Gaza and improving their condition but they want to get territorial ownership of the entirety of Israel which they claim to be the rightful owners of from before 1948 when Israel was created. That's is closer to (but still not the complete, it's more complicated) root of the conflict.

If they stuck to peaceful forms of protest they'd have some chance of having their voice heard while at the same time improving their conditions vastly. If they seek a peaceful solution they must convince Israelis that peace is possible in some form. It seems they are thinking about taking Israel by force eventually and are willing to wait it out as long as it takes (at least the leaders, not necessarily the man on the street who has no say).

Re: Marc Benioff joins Valley notables backing Gaza’s first coding academy

#70

I've been to Israel many times including during the time of the first Gaza conflict (Cast Lead). There were elections in 2006 and Hamas was elected over Fatah. Hamas does not recognize Israel and is declared a terrorist state by the US, EU as well as Israel. There were supposed to be elections in 2010 but Hamas will not allow them. Hamas has spent large sums of money shooting missiles into Israel and using concrete m…

> There were elections in 2006 and Hamas was elected over Fatah. If the people of the land don't elect the party we prefer (by cross-checking with our terrorist list) we have no choice but to support their seige, occupation and Apartheid.

The US, Israeli, and Polish governments don't represent significant chunks of their population (in the US, 50% of the population didn't vote for Trump). A government being elected does NOT equal a reason to ostracize all the people living there.

In Gaza people who protest against Hamas get killed. During the 2014 conflict, 70 people in Gaza were hung for being collaborators with Israel, with no trial, proof, etc.

Gazans who are not in favor of their government are between a rock and a hard place: ostracized by the international community for a government they didn't choose, and suffering due to the local politics that they don't approve of. Wouldn't you at least want to support the people whose perspectives you align with?

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