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Ageism is becoming an issue for me

scripting.com

61–70 of 72 posts

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#61
People are thinking of Dave Winer as "less intelligent, informed, clued, aware, whatever" because he's Dave Winer, because he can't be "part of an intelligent discussion". The only thing it has to to do with his age is that he's had decades of practice at screwing up technical matters, spoiling communities, and fucking over business partners.

He has a hell of a reputation as an asshole. I don't think anyone besides service employees care that he's old.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#62
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One was a consulting company, and the other person to tell me that was a recruiter as a reason for not submitting me for a job i.e., "they're looking for someone more senior"

See, that's actually quite interesting. Both of those live and die by their reputation, and for both of them, you would have been the "product" - the consultant to send to customers, and the potential recruit to present to companies. As a self-employed consultant I have found that some people get nervous when they find out my age (25, started when I was 23) - presumably because consultants are selling their expertise…

Very interesting points. You could be right.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#63

Well, but what if it's true? On the macro scale, I think it's obvious that people are getting smarter. If you compare people now with people 1000 years ago, it is obvious that the average IQ now is higher than it was then. If you compare with people 10k years ago, 100k ago .. no contest. There was a time when calculus was something only the smartest people in the world understood. Now it is a subject routinely taught…

That's really poor reasoning. Whether or not a 20-year-old today is smarter than a 20-year-old in 1900 tells you nothing about whether a 20-year-old today is smarter than a 40-year-old today.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#64

Well, but what if it's true? On the macro scale, I think it's obvious that people are getting smarter. If you compare people now with people 1000 years ago, it is obvious that the average IQ now is higher than it was then. If you compare with people 10k years ago, 100k ago .. no contest. There was a time when calculus was something only the smartest people in the world understood. Now it is a subject routinely taught…

The average IQ is always 100, regardless of the population.

At least, if they make the test the way they're supposed to.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#65
post #48

Wait until children learn how to type with their brainwaves. Then you'll be the old slow guy sitting there with the keyboard because your brain won't do that anymore (a la people raised by wolves)

It always blows my mind that my friends' children are growing up never having known a world without broadband connectivity in your hand, high-def (even 3D!) TV, GPS, manned space stations, buying everything online, and social networking.

If today's young teenagers (my wife's cousins are glued to their phones, sending hundreds of SMSes a week) are any indication, we have a very strange breed coming down the pipe.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#66
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What types of companies were you interviewing at? I've really never seen anything but ageism in the favor of younger people.

That's really strange. When I was just out of college no one took my work experience during college seriously, they all treated me like I was a clean slate even though I had about three years of part-time experience with two full-time summers. I was constantly told, when I actually got feedback, that I was too inexperienced. I was applying for entry-level positions, which these days means you need 1-2 years experienc…

You're probably not a talented sales person. You had 2 years equiv. experience, and should have pitched yourself that way.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like Dave Winer, I am also 54 and absolutely do not care what anyone else thinks about it. Perhaps that explains why you are also less likely to perceive it when it happens. Perhaps Dave Winer is more sensitive to this issue and that explains why he notices it more. I doubt that he is imagining this since you are one of the few people in IT that I have heard having a contrary experience. Perhaps you are simply an out…

I am guessing it could have a lot to do with the fact that Dave Winer is known to be a bit of a crank! He's historically gotten into a lot of ugly arguments, regardless of his age. It seems crazy to me now, but I worried most about ageism when I was around 38. I had just started a job in the Bay Area where almost everybody else was in their early twenties. To the extent that there was a problem, it was all in my head…

Well, age discrimination tends to become a personal issue when a person can be effected by it. Age is naturally only one factor in this.

If you happen to be in situation where age discrimination can't effect you, well, that's great.

If you think that's an excuse not to consider it as an important social issue, well, that's lousy.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am guessing it could have a lot to do with the fact that Dave Winer is known to be a bit of a crank! He's historically gotten into a lot of ugly arguments, regardless of his age. It seems crazy to me now, but I worried most about ageism when I was around 38. I had just started a job in the Bay Area where almost everybody else was in their early twenties. To the extent that there was a problem, it was all in my head…

Well, age discrimination tends to become a personal issue when a person can be effected by it. Age is naturally only one factor in this. If you happen to be in situation where age discrimination can't effect you, well, that's great. If you think that's an excuse not to consider it as an important social issue, well, that's lousy.

I guess I think that it is not a social issue for me, and it's up to others to make their own interpretations.

I think there are a lot of disadvantages that could drag you down: you're losing your hair, you're short, you're ugly, your parents put you through a rotten childhood, and so on. But you can always find examples of people who have those same disadvantages and are thriving anyway.

I knew this girl once who thought she was ugly. She mentioned that it goes beyond mere social conditioning, that even newborn babies react more favorably to pretty people. So I said: who would a newborn react more favorably to, a pretty stranger or her own homely mother?

If I am facing some type of disadvantage, I am always going to be looking for a way to stack the deck in my favor to get around it.

Re: Ageism is becoming an issue for me

#70
post #24
post #17

I don't think it's the age, but Winer is out of touch on a lot of issues. His primary computing time is in a scripting language / environment that he built in the early 90s. Much like RMS, he has missed the train and while still has important ideas is frequently only able to implement them in a way that few others can experience. That and his new found mobile passion is just hilarious to witness. Confused about SMS a…

This isn't really new. He's always been a bit fuzzy on technologies; neither RSS nor XML-RPC really show a deep understanding of XML, the scripting environment which I became deeply familiar with in college was always a bit weird about some of the fundamentals, etc. On the other hand, his resume blows mine away; his list of truly independent inventions may not be very long but the list of technologies that he is basi…

He's got a lot of GetItDoneness, even if his technical skills aren't always the absolute best.

9 times out of 10 I'd take the former over the latter...

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